Gotta love the supermarket grinder. Dis someone steal it from a Krogers or something?
After many days of awaiting its delivery UPS finally got my newest addition to the toy pile to me.
Yet another steal from evilBay it arrived in its factory original box and packing with the extra shear discs still taped to the inside and the instruction manual tucked into the bean bin. It is a Grindmaster 875 that has had the Eight OClock decal slapped on it.
Although labeled in the auction as a slightly used demo machine I can find no signs that its ever been actually used to grind any coffee. The grinder looks brand spanking new with not a scratch or bump on it with no grounds anywhere in it or the box and no oils in the bean bin. With their burr sets guaranteed for 30,000 pounds of coffee I think it safe to say that it will last me awhile. ::)
Java "No more running to the store for CP grinding sessions!" phile
Gotta love the supermarket grinder. Dis someone steal it from a Krogers or something?
Apparently Eight OClock Beans was trying to place themselves above ordinary grocery store coffees by trying to get the retailers to install grinders. The plan appears not to have worked and there are now a number of these grinders coming onto the market. Some of them labeled as brand new and selling for $USD200.
Seller rasche <*hint*hint* for those interested> failed to have bids on 2 of them starting at $200 with no reserve and a 3rd sold for $USD202.50. Had he properely labeled them as Grindmaster 875s in his ad or even just given the correct number of adjustments theyre capable of they would most likely have sold for $USD350 or higher. Based on his description and picture no one could tell that they were 875s or even for sure Grindmasters.
The 875 is Grindmasters top-of-the-line workhorse retail grinder (they have a 890 model that grinds faster but has no warranty at all on the burrs while the 875s burrs are warranted for 4 years/30,000lbs). They will replace the burrs and seals on them and do other basic maintenance for $USD190 and will do a total refurb on them for $USD330. The grinders sell new for $USD700.
There really isnt much call for something with the 875s capabilities among us but as I now have the ability to roast up 5 pounds of beans in a reasonable period of time I can do up my own roasts for my large batches of Cold Process coffee instead of buying the beans from a local speciality roaster and I would imagine there are a few others out there who might find this grinder useful. :D
While I drink (OK inhale) espresso based drinks while at home all day I use the CP for when Im away from home and for the first cup in the morning while the Cimbali is warming up. The one pound size batch of CP needed to be done every few days and that was with-out anybody else getting any. So I moved up to an industrial sized 5 pound press. Now I can make enough CP in one batch to last me 2 weeks (it will last for 3 weeks or more in the fridge) and still have enough to give away/sell a gallon or a gallon and a half to friends/friends-of-friends. Making everybody very happy. ;D
The late night manager at the local grocery store was getting tired of me coming in there and grinding up 5 pounds of beans and while the Super Jollys do a great job of espresso grinding theyre not really up to the task of grinding 5 pounds of coffee to a perk coarseness. So it was time to get something that was. :)
Java "The Grind-a-holic" phile
Ive seen grinders in supermarkets back home since the 90s. Unless the area had no whole beans to grind in the store, I dont see it as much of a new idea. About how far back did they try to make the grinding in-store coffee revolution?
As you say grinders have been in the stores for many a year now, and virtually all of them are branded by the bean supplier of the bulk gourmet beans sold in that store. Eight OClock wasnt trying to revolutionize anything, they were just trying to (re)claim a spot in the gourmet specialty bean market.Originally Posted by nunu link=1136514307/0#3 date=1136540743
Until the advent of the bulk specialty market EOC was seen as a gourmet bean. Once the specialty market hit its stride and bulk beans of a much higher quality started showing up in most larger grocery stores they lost that distinction, and their market niche, and in the now dramatically changed marketplace became just another common low end coffee.
Im not sure of all the details but I seem to recall that as part of their campaign EOC came out with several new coffees/roasts and was trying to bring back its image of being a gourmet bean by selling out of bulk bins rather than in its traditional 1 pound or what-ever packages. Judging by the number of these machines that are suddenly becoming available it would appear that they have failed in their effort. :-[
Java "A good deal if youve the need" phile
Those nifty bulk bins, with the blend name etc on there. Youd pull the knob and fill the bag, then dump the beans into the grinder. Set the grind consistency and away you go. The things were always a mess, since kids seemed to think it was a play toy. Nothing like stepping on a pile of beans on a waxed floor. IIRC the grinders were Bunn grindomatic or something like that...Brown ones, shorter than the 8oc one.
Thats a monster grinder! Im interested in the cold process coffee and read a thread about it posted last year. It it any good for making hot drinks?
Im sick of the instant at work and was looking at getting a 3 cup plunger, but the cold process also sounds good but appears to use more coffee. Must be nice on ice-cream. Cant seem to buy a Toddy over here but see some on *bay for about US$25.
Yeah, those are the older models. The newer top line models are taller so-as to be able to take a 14" bag.Originally Posted by nunu link=1136514307/0#5 date=1136552505
It seems the newness has finally worn off on having the whole beans in the stores and kids are playing with the bins a lot less now. I no longer see the massive mess around them like I used too.
Bunn and Grindmaster appear to be the two Big Boys in the commercial grinder market. Around here Grindmaster appears to have a much larger market share than Bunn. Whether thats due to having a better product, pricing, or marketing or due better performance and longevity I dont know as Im not done any research into that. I figured with Grindmaster having the good name that they do and with the burrs guaranteed for 30,000 pounds of coffee it would be more than sufficient for my needs. ;D
Java "Da happy grinder" phile
Hey Matt,Originally Posted by Matt G link=1136514307/0#6 date=1136676797
CP is wonderful for either hot or cold drinks. For hot coffee I mix at about 1:6 with hot water. For iced drinks I tend to use a bit more of the CP with my favorite combo being mixing it with milk at about a 1:5 ratio. Add a touch of sugar and youve got a coffee milkshake that slides down so easily and smoothly that you have to be careful how much you drink as you can *easily slam enough down to send you into orbit. ;D :o 8-)
As you might be able to tell I am a big fan of CP. I have found that is is second only to espresso for being the best method to get the full flavor out of the coffee. The subtle flavors of the beans are brought out better and are also more intense via espresso, but other than espresso nothing else even comes close to CP for preserving the innate flavor of the beans. French Press, Moka Pot, Drip Brewed, they all come in a very distant 2nd when compared too CP.
Youve got to love the ease of use of CP as well. A few minutes of work and youve got multiple days of coffee ready to go at a moments notice.
Using the 5lb industrial press I get a half gallon of concentrate per pound of coffee. With the 1lb press as I recall I got about 6 or maybe 7 cups of concentrate per pound of beans. This compares very favorably to what yould get if you used that same pound of beans for making espresso.
CP presses/toddys are available from a number of retailers on the web here in the US and Europe (Ive not looked into whats available in AUS) and come with a decanter fitted to the press for easy draining for about $USD25. If you buy one make sure to order an extra set of filters for it. Youll eventually need them and thatll save you the cost of shipping them seperately. Generally the extra filter pack comes with 2 filters and an extra plug for a couple of bucks.
In use you want as fine a grind as you can use with-out the filter plugging up. If your grinder doesnt produce much power you can usually grind at a Drip setting, otherwise youll have to use a coarser grind setting. Most store grinders seem to work best when set somewhere between Drip and Perc.
Ive found that it works best (when grinding at the store) to pour off the top inch or two of ground in the bag before dumping them into the press, then pour in the grounds from the top of the bag. This is because most of the powders (chaff and bean) cling to the spout on the grinder and are knocked off into your bag at the very end. These are what will clog your filter. By putting them on the top of the grounds in the press they will be used but will be filtered out by the mass of grounds before reaching the filter when draining.
When pouring in the beans DO NOT tamp them down by shaking/tapping the press or by stirring them! Ditto when you pour in the water, DO NOT stir the grounds or in any other way disturb them! Pour the water in slowly and evenly over the entire top of the grounds making sure everything gets moistened evenly. Ive found what works best is to add about half of the total water initially and then let the grounds sit for 15 minutes and then add the rest of the water using it to knock down the cap of beans that has formed on top. Once again pouring the water in slowly so-as to not stir/mix the grounds. If the filter plugs up during decanting youve got a real mess on your hands!
Once youre done draining the concentrate off dispose of the grounds and wash the filter off *immediately and *completely. Then flick as much water out of it as possible and put it in an open container, a baggie works fine, and put it in your fridge along with the plug to await its next usage. Make sure your hands are clean and soap free while doing this and DO NOT use any soap to clean the filter with! Soap, or anything else, is next to impossible to remove from the filter and will flavor your next batch.
If you wanted to see what CP tastes like prior to making the investment in a press/toddy its a simple matter to make up a small batch. Grind the desired amount of beans at as coarse a setting as the grinder has and put them into a container that you can easily pour from. Then add the water using about 2.5 cups of water per quarter pound of beans. In this case its actually better if the finer grind/powder is on the bottom of the container. Let the beans sit undisturbed for 24 hours and then slowly and carefully pour the liquid through a tea strainer and into a paper filter as is used on most drip brewers (using the brew basket with the filter in it works nicely, making sure to defeat its no drip feature) and let it drain into an appropriate container. Go slow and dont pour too much in at once as you will probably have to go through a couple of paper filters as they clog. Alternatively you could filter through a cloth rather than the paper filters.
CP provides a *great cuppa as most of the acids are not extracted from the beans as the whole process is done at room temp.
Java "CP Lover" phile
Thanks for the very detailed reply. Excellent post (Toppie button doesnt work on this laptop or else Id stick one in!) Im going to print this one out and file it away for later :) From your description Im keen to give it a shot. For a low cost item I may just be able to sneak it past the eagle eyed CFO. Im surprised I havent heard more about it. Ill try the paper filter version first and let you know what I think.
My pleasure Matt.
CP has been around a long time but for some reason has never seemed to have caught on except with a very small group. I was first introduced to it 27 years ago at a small local cooperative cafe run by a bunch of Hippies and immediately fell in love, both with the cafe and CP. ;D
Back then the only place to get a press/toddy was at one of the local community coops, also of course run by a bunch of Hippies (Can you tell who I hung out with? ;D). This was also right when the specialty coffee industry was taking off locally so there was a fairly good selection of fresh beans to choose from.
One of the things Ive done in lean times to stretch the budget was to do a double soak of the grounds. Do a 12 hour soak and after draining refill the press again and let it soak for 24 hours. The 2nd batch will be less flavorful and more acidic but with most beans will be quite drinkable when mixed stronger, although it will be no where near as good as the first soak!
This brings up the question of how long the beans should soak if you only do the one soaking. Ive heard times varying from as little as 8 hours out to 30 hours.
The taste will vary depending on how long you soak the grounds. The shorter soaks tend to make the flavor(s) of the coffee stand out more with extremely low acidity but the concentrate is not as strong as with the longer soaking times. That gain in intensity with the longer soaking times though is offset by a noticable increase in the acidity.
Another difference between the different soaking times is that the longer you soak the grounds, the longer the concentrate will last in the fridge. I assume this is due to the higher acidity.
Personally Ive found a soaking time of somewhere between 12 and 24 hours to work very nicely.
Another thing to consider in the soaking time is the ambient temperature. These times are assumming a room temperature of roughly 70-75F. At 60F (the temp in the brewing area during winter) I soak most beans for 24 hours. During the summer months when the temp is up around 80-85F that time is reduced to about 16 hours for most beans.
In general the lighter more floral coffees with low acidity get longer soaking times while the full bodied coffees with high acidity have their soak times reduced.
As with all the other forms of coffee drinking its all a matter of personal taste. Have fun experimenting and figuring out what you like best. :)
As an aside, one of the downsides of getting into the espresso was that my beloved CP lost some of its intensity and flavor. I had a laugh Instead of being compared to brewed coffee (which its an order of magnitude better than!) it was suddenly going up against the espresso which had become a regular household feature. Now that Ive been drinking The Real Stuff (espresso) for so long I find that only very rarely can I choke down a cup of brewed coffee no matter how good the beans pedigree or fresh the roast is. It just tastes like....a poor imitation of Coffee. :P
Java "OK, I admit it, Im a snob!" phile
Javaphile, thanks alot for your informative posts about Cold process/ Cold brew/ Toddy coffee.
Id never come across this method of brewing coffee before, but after reading your posts, Ive got to sample it at least once. Something I should try before I die!
After a mandatory google, I noticed that it is also called toddy coffee.
In parts of SE Asia (India, Sri Lanka, Burma/Myanamar, Indonesia, Philippines...) toddy is the name given to an alcoholic beverage made from palm or coconut sap. Also called "Hta Yei", Jus de Toddy or Mandalay beer. Toddy can be quite potent and has made me snoozy on the occasions Ive imbibed.
When coconut toddy is distilled, it is then called Arrack/Arrak, a whiskey like drink, but sweeter like a dark rum. Apparently it was the most popular form of alcohol in Sri Lanka. But in the last 20 years with television, the westernisation of the population, local breweries springing up and refrigerators being available to most it is now considered a poor mans drink and most prefer to drink whiskey followed by beer.
Interesting . . .
I just sold one of these 875s on evilBay myself (mine was labeled Brothers Coffee, another gourmet line that came and went, uh, POOF!). Although I was able to grind a good Turkish and espresso, when I dialed it up to percolator (or above) for French Press, I got a lot of fines in the grind. I contacted a local representative for repair advice and he said that there may be some burr alignment problems. $190 USD to accomplish a minimal refurb. Heck I paid $200 for it, so decided to see what I could get for it: even with the problem with the fines fully described, the auction got me more than I paid for it (albeit only a little more). Sorry to see that old horse go . . .
Now dialing in a Macap MC4 doserless that I purchased new. Well see how it goes.