Ive a few questions:
Is it as quiet as a Robur?
Is it smaller than a Robur?
Hows it compared to the Kony?
Some interesting info on this grinder this arvo...
The price has actually come down! Its now $1950 which is a whole heap cheaper than a Mazzer Robur :o
I have updated the review and pics of the K10 in the reviews section at the top of this thread....
This is a great top end cafe grinder and also marketed to baristi gearing up for competition....
Ive a few questions:
Is it as quiet as a Robur?
Is it smaller than a Robur?
Hows it compared to the Kony?
1? I would assume so- theyre hand-built and spin very slowly. Even the Rossi MC is really quietOriginally Posted by Sparky link=1171437692/0#1 date=1171438712
2? Dimensions are listed- the robur is taller
3? No contest...It competes with the Mazzer robur- the best of their bunch
When you say 3? no contest, do you mean in thoughput, or grind quality? I know Im really picking nits here, but you have to have a grinder to aspire to. Besides the Robur is so quiet, its hard to believe its a high throuput grinder.
The Kony was one of the grinders on my grinder upgrade path, thats why Im interested in it. The Robur is just too gargantuan for even me.
Actually the two grinders on my upgrade list are the Kony or Cimbali Max. But the K10 WBC now seems within striking distance...
Mark- the Kony is slooooooooooooooooooow *::)...Grind quality is ok, but throughput sucks. Id have a Rossi MC in preference any day....BTW, theyre a bargain...Nevertheless, I think anyone planning on competing would be having a long chat with some owners of whatever grinder they were planning on getting. All grinders have pros and cons....Originally Posted by Sparky link=1171437692/0#3 date=1171439749
The Robur has a RRP of [s]$2.8k[/s] (edit now $3k)- with lower street prices of course ;)....
Is that a left-handed doser?
Compaks can be changed to left or right.
Ill say! I couldnt believe that $2.8k is the RRP!Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1171437692/0#4 date=1171440345
While were talking conicals,
How much do the Kony, Cimbali Max and Rossi MC go for?
Whats the cheapest quality conical grinder available i.e Mazzer Mini grind quality or greater?
Whats the best value conical grinder?
Is grind quality the main judge of a grinder?
When will the perfect home grinder be made?
Will Warnie make a comeback?
Are you saying the Macap I have at home is not perfect?
Of course not! It goes without saying that the M5 is perfect.
It s just that its price is too low. I wouldnt be seen dead with such a cheap grinder.
Off topic replies have been moved to [link=http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1171623577]This Thread[/link]
I received a Compak K10 WBC in Platinum/aluminium...will give it a good thrasing this week and post up my impressions.
Not the colour I wanted but will do for now...
Sorry...the above post was meant to come from this account and not Veneziano....why is it that whenever I post under the sponsor login, I can never edit or delete posts?
Try logging off and then back on again. :)Originally Posted by Wushoes - David S link=1171437692/0#13 date=1200474436
Java "The cookie monster" phile
Just to clarify on the Compak Grinder Range.
We bring all Compak Grinders (in their dosing range) ie:
- K3 Elite
- K10 and K10WBC
with dosing levers on the right hand side - unfortunatly the only pictures available are shown with levers on the left hand side.
Further to clarify on the standard K10 and K10WBC - their technical specs are identical (go to the compak website http://www.compak.es/en/productos/0201.htm - the only difference between them is the colour and the fact that the standard K10 comes with an auto-stop facility as standard. We bring both versions to Australia with the WBC Competition doser (ie. without a built in tamper).
And at present the RRP of both models is $1950 inc GST.
Diamond C Services
- Great grinder for the money.
- Sits between Mazzer Robur and Mazzer Major...i.e. not on the same level as the Robur....just slightly under it with smaller burrs and slower RPM.
- Doser is great. Sweeps very cleanly and the drop is very good. There is very little throw to the left and no static in the doser (something Compak has fixed).
- The chute between the burrs and the doser is quite big. A fair bit of coffee sits in the chute, but is inconsequential in busy espresso bars.
- Stepless mechanism is good. Good locking pin.
- The pin to hold in the doser will crack the hopper if you tighten it up too much. Perhaps Compak can drill a small hole in the neck of the hopper to minimise this....easy after-market mod to do.
- Grind quality is is quite good. Compared to a Mazzer Major, the pours hold their colour very well. Nice thick syrupy pours as expected from a conical. Conicals in my opinion are far superior to flat burr grinders.
- Very quiet grinder.
- Build quality could be slightly better. No complaints though, no vibrations at all...which is what the foam underneath the collar and hopper are there for.
Will try to do a shootout between a Robur, BNZ conical and the WBC K10.
Im collecting mine tomorrow- and Im happy about that!
What times coffee at your place Chris?Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1171437692/15#17 date=1200562650
Nice...will be interesting to hear your thoughts....come in for a coffee at Veneziano.Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1171437692/15#17 date=1200562650
I am on a learning curve with grinders. I see from the WBC regs that the only grinder to be used, as supplied, appears to be this grinder. Why was that grinder chosen....does it mean that the organisation believed that it was the best grinder available? Did they believe that it was the best value for money and therefore aspiring Barista champions might obtain one and practice with it? Or is it supplied free or at cost etc and that is the reason? Or another reason(s)?
...I also read on portafilter.net that they are prone to breaking the hopper where the adjustment pin is located?
Originally Posted by ozscott link=1171437692/15#21 date=1200961753
To answer both your questions - firstly Compak are the sponsors of the World Barista Championship because like any company they pay for the privilege.
However that is not to say that the organization would accept the sponsorship cash unless the product itself was of a quality to be associated with the competition.
Be a bit silly for the WBC to accept sponsorship from Sunbeam because they put up the most cash and then have to use the Sunbeam Grinder in WBC Competition.
Also with the hopper - this is only a problem if you adjust to the screw too tightly - of course it will crack the hopper - the screw only needs to just touch the hopper base to hold it in place.
After a week of K10 ownership, I cant really add a great deal to what David has said. I am thrilled with the grinder and the way it works. The mazzer mini hasnt been used that much but will head to the showroom shortly to make way for a Macap M5E.
It is a tad fiddly to remove the dosing chamber cover to brush off- but thats just making me more accurate.
Throughput is terrific and Im not sure if its placebo effect, but I reckon Im getting more creamy moussey character in my shots.
The hopper can be drilled but Im not fussed. It is a big grinder for home but the plan is to put a K3 hopper onto is which will bring it back to size.
Money well spent I reckon.
I really, really want one :)
Another complaint after 2 weeks ownership....
totally forgot about the plastic dosing fork...bounces up and down when collapsing...also the grinds tray could be a bit of a better fit.
In regards to the locking pin for the grind adjustment collar...Id like to revisit that...it seems to have a slight wobble when releasing the pin....bad thing?? who knows....Chris...have you noticed this?
Not where the adjustment pin is located; where the hopper locking pin is located. *The hopper locking pin basically screws directly in against the plastic, which looks like it might be brittle. *As Chris said, you could always drill a hole in there and it wouldnt be a problem. *You could also put some rubber on the end of the hopper locking screw, I guess.Originally Posted by ozscott link=1171437692/15#21 date=1200961753
The doser thing is, frankly, an utterly trivial problem. *Id be more concerned about what happened to Ken Foxs K10 - the on/off switch was broken on delivery, then motor mounts broke, plus the coffee wasnt feeding correctly from the exit of the burrs to the entrance of the doser ... when he took it apart, he found like 1/2kg of ground coffee around the motor! *Moral of the story: be careful when shipping these things! Ken was an early adopter and apparently Compak has since then corrected the problems, plus their US branch is replacing his grinder.
When I asked Nim about the K10 hed been using, he said that you could even see the difference in shot quality ... he reckoned there was something like 5 seconds more pour time and volume than on the Major. Id love to stick a K10 next to a three phase robur and see if we could stretch that time out even more!Originally Posted by 2muchcoffeeman link=1171437692/15#24 date=1201035620
Originally Posted by luca link=1171437692/15#28 date=1201094003
Why dont you head down to St. Ali in South Melbourne - Mark has a 3 phase Robur and a Compak K10 side by side. ;)
Hehehe ... seems that Compak really is keen to improve its grinders. Remember how the first lots of the K3 elite were basically unusable, but then they redid the dosing chute and made it into one mean contender at the price point? Well the K10 WBC version that the WBC equipment committee has been testing out at Vancouver seems to have a metal dosing fork and a normal doser lid cover, presumably so that it doesnt look so half-baked when the lid is removed. At the very least, I would hope that the metal dosing fork would be made available to current K10 owners. Compak also had a prototype doserless grinder at Vancouver, but I didnt catch whether it was conical or just that flat burr thing they have been promising for a while.
Oddly, Mazzer didnt submit anything for consideration as the official WBC grinder.
Because they usually have customers to deal with! Ill ask Toshi about it.Originally Posted by Metreo link=1171437692/15#29 date=1201095455
Mazzer isnt interested in sponsoring WBC. Theyre never going to put up the money required.Originally Posted by luca link=1171437692/30#30 date=1201176408
I seriously hope Compak make the K10 metal forks available to current owners. The plastic one is SHIT
If the prices were the same, which one would you take - K10 or Robur?
Mazzer seem to have a very different philosophy to Compak. Compak seems to seek feedback from everyone, makes changes quickly and gains market share by building to a price point. Mazzer seems to keep in touch with its distributor network, keeps developments under wraps and sets the price points. All of the praise that has been heaped on Compak shouldnt be read as saying that Mazzers are bad. Both the companies and the grinders are very different, and ultimately this sort of competition can only be good for the consumer.Originally Posted by Dennis link=1171437692/30#32 date=1204542724
Given that I reported about Compaks WBC spec upgrades, it would be unfair of me not to report on Mazzers latest Robur upgrades. The most obvious improvement is a neat little device that looks like it might cut up any unusually large beans (eg. maragogype) and seems to pretty much stop popcorning ... almost looks like a third burr. The dosers also seem to have improved; they are pretty much dropping straight, with maybe a small left throw ... in some cases you can even get a small right throw!
Personally, I would go for the Robur over the K10 if prices were the same.
Robur...end of story. The new gen ones are SICK. Weve had the luxury of playing with around 4 new generation roburs at work.Originally Posted by Dennis link=1171437692/30#32 date=1204542724
In competition, the Robur is a weapon.....on an everyday bar, nothing can beat it...currently. Still king of the hill. Thats not to say a K10 is a bad grinder!
Have you tried the K6 forks?Originally Posted by Wushoes - David S link=1171437692/30#31 date=1201257582
They might fit?!??!
I have been thrilled with my K10.
The fork hasnt bothered me and for domestic use, I specified a K3 hopper, so its a heap shorter as well.
I really dont think that you can do a comparison point blank- they are different grinders at dramatically different price points. The compak has a smaller burr set and as a result, the throughput is not that of a Mazzer. Motor RPM is lower too. The grind quality is superb IMHO.
What I am seeing is that there is a definite difference in the cup for an identical dose and pour time over the mazzer mini.
I think this is a terrific value cafe grinder (perhaps even a no brainer against a SJ or Major) and if you want the best as a home grinder, look seriously at the Compak. No grinder I have seen so far sweeps cleaner than Compak- although it sounds like Mazzer is finally addressing this.
For me, the Mazzer was just too expensive and much too tall. I guess that if price was no object, youd go the Robur 3 phase but they are huge $$$ and youd need to be a really busy cafe....
Open house (by arrangement ;)) for any CSer in Melbourne who would like to look and play.
Nice...will check it out...theyre metal are they?Originally Posted by Andy Freeman link=1171437692/30#35 date=1204553594
Similar to the fork released by Compak for WBC certification in Vancouver earlier this year?
After a few weeks of having a K10, it is definately value for money. I still prefer working with the Mazzers in some respects, but for the $$$s the K10 is an awesome grinder. If you cannot justify the $$$s of the Robur, I think the K10 is a great alternative. We replaced 2 x Super Jollys with 1 x K10, and I think it was the best decision we made. In terms of espresso quality there is a serious difference and it keeps us on the ball in slow periods with its grind speed too.
Nice...will check it out...theyre metal are they?
Have you tried the K6 forks?
They might fit?!??!
Similar to the fork released by Compak for WBC certification in Vancouver earlier this year?[/QUOTE]
I didnt see the fork that you speak of but yes, long and metal. We had the K6 at home until I upgraded it. If you sit the group handle a little sideways it stays there. , The K6 now lives at the Snobbery, will check out the fittings when I roast later today (although I think from memory it might be attached from inside the body not outside).
I am SO excited! :D :D
I ordered one of these off Dennis at cuppacoffee earlier in the week. Both Dennis and Chris at Talk Coffee have been very helpful and an absolute pleasure to deal with.
All things going to plan, Ill be collecting my new baby on Saturday at the cuppacoffee Grand Opening II. Cant wait to join all the other happy owners of the K10!
Awesome! You should bring your machine down and pull us a few shots ;)Originally Posted by 79706B7279747C110 link=1171437692/40#40 date=1235021148
Well Done Hazchem, welcome to the club. An absolute animal for the home set up IMO ;)
Agreed,Originally Posted by 4354554B5E5F54000300310 link=1171437692/42#42 date=1235092400
As they say: "Once youve had WBC black, you never look back". ;D
There would have to be something pretty special to displace either of my WBCs....
Not a bad idea Grant, but I plan on having a grand unboxing when I get the K10 home, in true gadget geek style! Ill most likely post photos to my Picasa account ...Originally Posted by 7F6B70777E7C467D6E7C75757C6B190 link=1171437692/41#41 date=1235087520
yup, i fully expect it to be an animal, a beautiful animal on my kitchen bench. Cant wait to start wrangling it.Originally Posted by 6B7C7D6376777C282B28190 link=1171437692/42#42 date=1235092400
yep, thats the general idea Chris, I dont plan on having to replace or upgrade again ever! Thanks for the prompt shipping to cuppacoffee too, it was very hard to resist booking a meeting into my calendar today and finding myself in Sylvania instead of Artarmon where my customers are. *;)Originally Posted by 2B746C7A717A767F7F7C7C747877190 link=1171437692/43#43 date=1235099648
Hi people. Glad i came across this post as i have been looking to upgrade for some time now from my Compak k5. by the way i havent seen the k5 mentioned before. not even Michael from Diamond C listed it. anyway have been happy with the k5 but have never had anything else to compare it with.
The Compak K5 has long been deleted from Compaks range. ;)
If your looking for comparable cutter size go for the K6 and it gives you the added benefit of complete metal doser.
If the K6 is too big go down to the K3 Elite. ;)
Thanks Metreo. thought there had to be a logical reason. Think ill go straight to the K10 as it is for my business. I bought the K5 in 05 so obviously a lot of upgrades since then.
well, Ive had the K10WBC at home for a couple of weeks now and I just love it! So easy to use and the difference in the coffee I am making has been immense. I can detect a wider range of flavours in my shots now but still lack the palate to describe them.
Once again Im reminded that one of the awesome things about espresso and coffee in general is that there is always more to learn!
I had a few people over on the weekend for a party and of course, now I am feeling a little limited by Ms Silvia in terms of not being able to texture milk and extract coffee at the same time. BUT she is loving the K10 and making great shots with the coffee its grinding.
Way to go! Im sure the Compak dwarfs over the Silvia. Upgraditis on the machine some time soon me thinks.... ;)