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Thread: Eureka Mignon Upgrade

  1. #1
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    Eureka Mignon Upgrade

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi All, I'm looking for advice on upgrading from a eureka mignon. Currently this is paired with a Bezzera BZ10 however I find it slightly noisy and extremely clumpy.

    My budget is <$800. Something quieter than the mignon would be nice. Not so fussed on timed or weighted doses.

    I only drink milk based coffees.

    Cheers

    Ben.

  2. #2
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    G'day Ben...

    Would be very difficult to go past a Macap M2M for your purposes.
    Relatively quiet, excellent quality and lots of very happy CS owners around to offer assistance if ever required...

    Mal.

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    Below is a pic of the grind I'm getting from the mignon, it comes out kind of in pellets. Is this normal for entry level doserless grinders? I'm leaning towards a 2018 model Macap m2m at the moment. Will this solve my problem?

    20190411_073858.jpg

  4. #4
    Senior Member deegee's Avatar
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    My M2M has been working for about 2 years, and has never clumped at all, no matter what beans I put through it.
    There are some good prices on the old model since the new one was released. It has stepped adjustments, but they are small steps and I have no trouble getting the right setting for a good shot.

    I mostly use a bottomless P/F and get a very good looking cone pour almost every time.
    When I don't, it's because I have been careless or lazy with my tamping. I don't need to do anything special - just settle the grinds in the basket, a light nutation, then a straight firm tamp. No stirring, no fancy leveling tools, inexpensive tamper.
    I believe it's that easy because I'm working with well ground beans.

  5. #5
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    Ben, I can see why you are concerned. Not sure of the problem you are having (besides weird looking) but have you thought of trying weiss technique - swirling around with a toothpick? Or maybe doing what Niche does, grind into a cup then pour into a portafilter. Either a worth a try for a few days, much cheaper than a new grinder and costs nothing to try.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 338 View Post
    Ben, I can see why you are concerned. Not sure of the problem you are having (besides weird looking) but have you thought of trying weiss technique - swirling around with a toothpick? Or maybe doing what Niche does, grind into a cup then pour into a portafilter. Either a worth a try for a few days, much cheaper than a new grinder and costs nothing to try.
    Thanks for the response. I'm currently doing the swirl technique however would like to do away with all the messing around. Like deegee said, i'd like to just grind, levelling bump and tamp.

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    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentj View Post
    Below is a pic of the grind I'm getting from the mignon, it comes out kind of in pellets. Is this normal for entry level doserless grinders? I'm leaning towards a 2018 model Macap m2m at the moment. Will this solve my problem?

    20190411_073858.jpg
    Something doesn't look right there SJ, shouldn't be clumping like that, as a matter of interest have you given it a good clean? i.e. grind chamber, burrs and delivery chute, looks to me the grind path is somehow restricted and the ground coffee is compacting before being expelled.
    https://clivecoffee.zendesk.com/hc/e...g-Jammed-Burrs
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelta View Post
    Something doesn't look right there SJ, shouldn't be clumping like that, as a matter of interest have you given it a good clean? i.e. grind chamber, burrs and delivery chute, looks to me the grind path is somehow restricted and the ground coffee is compacting before being expelled.
    https://clivecoffee.zendesk.com/hc/e...g-Jammed-Burrs
    TBH I haven't. However it has been doing this since day one. Thanks for the above link.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentj View Post
    TBH I haven't. However it has been doing this since day one. Thanks for the above link.
    How long have you owned the machine, was it new or second hand?

    Even if new its not impossible that it had beans through it prior to your purchase.

    I assume the burrs are in good condition?

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    I purchased brand new. I'll give it a good clean this weekend using the link provided and see how it goes.

    THanks again.

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    Senior Member Brewster's Avatar
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    Hi Ben.
    Sorry I can't provide a solution to your problem.
    Just wanted to say that I have owned a Mignon for many years now and have a very high opinion of it.
    I use it daily and can say it has never produced anything like your pic.
    I also have it's big brother, the Atom, only because of a severe case of upgradeitis, but have no intentions of parting with the Mignon such is the high regard I have for it.


    Cheers
    Mal
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  12. #12
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Also this post from a person called Kolu in Home Barista mentions removing the bottom burr and cleaning under it, would be worth doing.

    "most probably there is a lot of coffee under the bottom burr carrier. that means 11 or 10 mm spanner, clockwise unscrewing (I thing it is reverse thread, not sure at this moment, you have to turn the same direction as the burrs do to unscrew the nut on top) carrier removal and cleaning the space beneath."

    As a PS Ben, there seem to be a lot of happy Mignon users out there with very few complaints, there must be a solution to your problem, judging by the regularity of size as well as the shape (almost like cubes) it looks like the ground coffee is compacting in the chute then being pushed out by whats in the grinding chamber, then the process starts over.
    Last edited by Yelta; 11th April 2019 at 06:30 PM.

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    I have the Mignon Specialita which is the latest version and absolutely love it, there must be something wrong with yours because my grinds certainly don't come out like that. Give it a good clean and see if any improvement, maybe you need new burrs?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentj View Post
    Below is a pic of the grind I'm getting from the mignon, it comes out kind of in pellets. Is this normal for entry level doserless grinders? I'm leaning towards a 2018 model Macap m2m at the moment. Will this solve my problem?
    It might just be the photo but that looks to be very finely ground coffee and may be the cause for the cubic compression of the grounds while they're travelling through the exit chute...

    Perhaps try a slightly coarser grind and increase the dose a bit at a time and see how you go...

    Mal.
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  15. #15
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Under the Eureka badge at the front is a screw. If you undo this screw you can remove the part that holds the exit chute in place: place it carefully aside, don't break the two wires to the switch. Underneath you will find a black plastic grinds guide with a crosspiece. Remove this and clean it thoroughly, making sure all the guide chambers are clear.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    It might just be the photo but that looks to be very finely ground coffee and may be the cause for the cubic compression of the grounds while they're travelling through the exit chute...

    Perhaps try a slightly coarser grind and increase the dose a bit at a time and see how you go...

    Mal.
    Thanks, i'll give that a try after a thorough clean. I just find that any coarser results in too fast a pour. I usually have it set between 1.5 - 2.5 depending on beans with 18g grind.
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  17. #17
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    I had a Mignon and liked it (only upgraded as got a Niche very cheap), easy to adjust and clean (bottom burr moves not top so can take off top burr and adjustment doesn’t change). I ended up single dosing in my Mignon as don’t like to leave beans n a hopper. I got a 25DIN PVC pipe joiner to use as a hopper as would hold 18gm of beans. Send me a PM if want more details but it was nothing special.
    i don’t remember having to adjust to the amount of a whole number, more like 0.5 of a number over the age of a bean. I’d ask you if your beans are fresh and consistent as that amount of change from my experience seems more then I needed.
    as others said give it a cleanout including the chute and be careful not to go too fine and clog the grid as that’s why your seeing the square compacted brick/log pieces. I only got clumping If was too fine.
    Remember if you weigh your dose into the portafilter you’ll get better consistentcy but you’ll also have some retention in the chute from last coffee so purging 2-3gm may help you get more consistency
    hope that helps.
    honestly think you best to spend your $800 on a second hand grinder to purchase something like a Atom or similar to get a higher level grinder or you’ll not get as large of a step up as your thinking you’ll get.
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    So gave it a good clean today, removed a good 3-4gms from inside the shute. The first 5-10g came out unclumpy but then started to clump again.
    I currently have it set on 1.5 with beans that were roasted 9 days ago. Let's say the grind is too fine, does anyone have any suggestions? I weigh my grind every time to 18g, if I make the grind coarser I don't get near the magic 40g in 30 seconds rule of thumb.
    What do other mignon users have the grind setting on?
    Ben.

  19. #19
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    For context what machine and basket are you using?
    Ever done a the 5 cent test with your current 18gm to see if your dose is height is good, under or over?

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    18g vst basket. Bezzer bz10 machine.

    With the 5c test, what's the expected outcome? A light impression of the coin in the puck?

  21. #21
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    Yes a small/light impression is what I aim for as you can see you have 1mm of clearance. A 5c coin is 1.3mm thick in case helps.
    i asked as when I had issues and was grinding too fine to compensate it was due to under dosing. Well that was one of my learning to making constantly good (for me) coffee
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  22. #22
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    On my Specialita, I have the grind setting between 1 and 2 and for a double basket I let it run for 11 seconds to provide 16gm of coffee. Makes a great espresso.

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    Cheers. I think I'm going to upgrade to a eureka atom.

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    Sorry to bump this again. I think I've decided on the Eureka Specialita. The size, quietness and claimed anti clumping are all very appealing however, due to location, I'm unable to see one in the flesh.
    Aside from the above mentioned benefits, do people think I would taste a difference in the cup between the original eureka mignon and the new eureka Specialita?

    Thanks again,

    Ben.

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    The new Rocket Faustino is also joining this bunch. They're talking up silence and anti-clump and give they're Eureka based, may be worth a look. Design looks good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinator View Post
    The new Rocket Faustino is also joining this bunch. They're talking up silence and anti-clump and give they're Eureka based, may be worth a look. Design looks good.
    it's definitely a nice looking unit. The extra $500 turns me off though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentj View Post
    The extra $500 turns me off though.
    The extra $500 you refer to is actually $100 at RRP. Probably just about covers the cost of adding the dosing cone to the design. Apples with apples- as they say..

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    Eureka Zenith (id cut down the hopper), Eureka Atom or rocket Fausto would be my pick.
    i think the Mignon range is priced a bit high when you look at compact and Macap offerings of similar range but depends on the value you put on some of the features.
    maybe look at the Niche zero grinder (conical burrs)

    Depends on how you want to use a grinder (hopper or single dose) and if has to be brand new or second hand okay.

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    Mmm... now you've got me interested in the fausto. I try not to leave too many beans in the hopper though not interested in single dosing.

    I don't find the next class up of eureka particularly visually appealing.

    I guess the extra couple of hundred dollars for the fausto is nothing over 5 years.

    Ben

  30. #30
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinator View Post
    The new Rocket Faustino is also joining this bunch. They're talking up silence and anti-clump and give they're Eureka based, may be worth a look. Design looks good.
    Unless something has changed since it came out it doesn't have any sort of silencing like the Eurekas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by level3ninja View Post
    Unless something has changed since it came out it doesn't have any sort of silencing like the Eurekas.
    Rocket are claiming it does. Idrinkcoffee quotes:

    Silent Technology
    The exclusive anti-vibration solution reduces the grinding noise by approximately 20 dB compared to the conventional grinders and paves the way for a new way of grinding coffee: accurate and quiet.

  32. #32
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    That's a quote from websites about the Eureka grinders, I can't find reference to it in relation to the Rocket.

  33. #33
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    I found a little bit on the idrinkcoffee page about the Fausto. It first calls it an Atom

    635 gram Hopper
    The Atom's uniquely designed hopper holds 635 grams or 1.4 lbs of whole beans.
    Then the only evidence they have for it being quiet is it's made by Eureka who make quiet grinders.

    Silent
    Designed by Rocket, the Fausto is manufactured by Eureka, a complany well known to produce grinders famous for their silent operation.

  34. #34
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    20dB is a hell of a reduction, would be interesting to see how this was done and how the 'improvement' was measured...

    Mal.
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  35. #35
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Yep, 99% reduction in acoustic power. Not easily achieved (BTW I used to work in the audio field, a very strong interest of mine waning as I slowly go deaf)
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  36. #36
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    Sorry to go off topic, Lyrebird does that mean generally that say a grinder with 20db reduction would be 1% as loud as the original item?

  37. #37
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    I recently had a Mahlkoenig Vario in the house which I bought from a fellow snobber for my brother in law. While it was here I took the opportunity to test it against my Breville BCG820 and my Eureka Atom. I used my most scientific cat scratching post to rest my phone with an uncalibrated decibel meter app. I found the Vario and the Smart Grinder to be very similar, and the Atom to be about 10dB less than both of them.

    20190421_221727.jpg
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  38. #38
    Senior Member level3ninja's Avatar
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    I thought it doubled/halved every 10dB, so 20dB would be 75% reduction in power?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    20dB is a hell of a reduction, would be interesting to see how this was done and how the 'improvement' was measured...

    Mal.
    My guess is from the next room over... 20db is so massive a shift I the noise floor I can't help but be more than a little skeptical
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  40. #40
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 338 View Post
    Sorry to go off topic, Lyrebird does that mean generally that say a grinder with 20db reduction would be 1% as loud as the original item?
    As measured, yes. To your ears, no.

    Acoustic response is logarithmic, it takes ten times as much power to increase the acoustic level by one Bel*, that being the definition of the unit. Since the Bel is fairly useless, we commonly use 1/10th of a Bel, a decibel.

    Your brain reinterprets this on a different perceptual scale, so you can hardly hear a difference of 1 dB. A 3 dB difference (very nearly half / double the power level) is perceived as small but significant. A 10 dB difference is obvious.

    A 20 dB difference is very obvious but the point in my post above is that such a difference is very, very difficult to achieve by damping / masking an existing source, you have to stop 99% of the acoustic power getting out. Most damping materials are simply not that efficient.


    * 1 Bel = the log base 10 of the ratio of powers, since 10^1 = 10, 1 Bel is a ratio of 10:1, since 10^2 = 100, 2 Bel is a ratio of 100:1. The unit was named for Alexander Graham Bell but with the last "l" left off, I don't know why. The only other SI unit I can think of where they don't complete the name is the Poise (a unit of viscosity) but that's because no-one can pronounce Poiseuille.
    Last edited by Lyrebird; 21st April 2019 at 11:24 PM.
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  41. #41
    Senior Member Lyrebird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by level3ninja View Post
    I thought it doubled/halved every 10dB, so 20dB would be 75% reduction in power?
    No, it roughly halves for 3 dB since the log10 of 2 is very close to 0.3 (it's about 0.3010). If you can do powers / logs in your head*, the easy thing to remember is that 2^10 is about 10^3 (actually 1024).


    * yes, I'm one of those weirdos.
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    Quote Originally Posted by level3ninja View Post
    I found a little bit on the idrinkcoffee page about the Fausto.
    The Fausto is a more logical competitor to the Atom 65 which seems not to come to Australia. The Faustino is a new grinder which appears to be based on Mignon.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caffeinator View Post
    The Fausto is a more logical competitor to the Atom 65 which seems not to come to Australia. The Faustino is a new grinder which appears to be based on Mignon.
    My mistake, I hadn't realised the Faustino was actually a thing now. When the Fausto came out there were a few autocorrects to Faustino so I assumed that was still the case. That being said I still can't find any mention of the Faustino having any silencing.

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    Ended up going with the Eureka Specialita. Very happy with this decision, whilst I'm sure there are higher end grinders, this is a definite upgrade on the old mignon as far as taste in the cup goes. Not too mention significantly quieter and much less clumpy. Very happy!
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