Results 1 to 21 of 21

Thread: Why so bitter baby????????

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10

    Why so bitter baby????????

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    After lots of reading other posts and success stories of home roasting I decided to give it a go.
    Now it seems to me that if you place a large stainless collander in a large stainless saucepan, set up a good quality heat gun on a tripod and using a large whisk to keep the beans moving while roasting then you basically have a corretto copy, right?
    Anyhow, thats my reasoning and thats what I did.
    Also cut a hole in the lower side of a 20 litre plastic bucket to fit my blower vac into with the collander snuggly in the top to cool the beans real quick which worked a treat,(on vac of course).
    Did several roasts on several different beans. All seemed to get first & second crack in about the right time frames and the roasts looked OK.
    Problem is they were all BITTER in the cup and undrinkable.
    I know its not my barista skills as my machinery and grinder are top spec and always produce great coffe that I am unable to get over the counter *99% *of the time.
    Can someone tell me please, Why so bitter baby????
    The only thing I can think of is Im not getting enough heat penetration into the centre of the bean....but I wouldnt know as I have no way to monitor the temp. :(

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    979

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    If the beans are under roasted they will taste overly acidic as opposed to *bitter.
    Can you take some good quality photos of the beans it might help us diognose?

    Assuming that the bitterness is not coming from roasting the beans too dark? There are a number of things that could be causing bitterness.

    Tipping/scorching is where the heat is too concentrated too fast on the outside of the bean. This is evident in an uneven color on the surface of the bean especially on the ends/tips where it will be darker. *I would recommend moving the heat gun back a tad. Better mixing will also help.

    Uneven roasting will also result in bitter flavours Bitterness is a very powerful flavor and even just a couple of burnt beans will carry through in the cup. If you are getting a few darker beans in your roast then I recommend pulling them out before ginding and also look at better agitation for your roaster.

    How dark you are roasting? Try pulling your roasts at the first signs of second crack rather then rolling second crack. Oily beans usually indicate you have roasted too deep and often indicate bitterness.

    Im not sure how fresh your drinking your coffee but a few extra days rest can work wonders in mellowing out coffee that is otherwise too acidic or too bitter.

    Where were you getting your beans previously? Im curious what coffee you were using before that you are now comparing your own roasts too.

  3. #3
    A_M
    A_M is offline
    Guest
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    6,381

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Quote Originally Posted by 131D10101F1219086568510 link=1256536409/0#0 date=1256536409
    After lots of reading other posts and success stories of home roasting I decided to give it a go.
    Now it seems to me that if you place a large stainless collander in a large stainless saucepan, set up a good quality heat gun on a tripod and using a large whisk to keep the beans moving while roasting then you basically have a corretto copy, right?
    Anyhow, thats my reasoning and thats what I did.
    Also cut a hole in the lower side of a 20 litre plastic bucket to fit my blower vac into with the collander snuggly in the top to cool the beans real quick which worked a treat,(on vac of course).
    Did several roasts on several different beans. All seemed to get first & second crack in about the right time frames and the roasts looked OK.
    Problem is they were all BITTER in the cup and undrinkable.
    I know its not my barista skills as my machinery and grinder are top spec and always produce great coffe that I am unable to get over the counter *99% *of the time.
    Can someone tell me please, Why so bitter baby????
    The only thing I can think of is Im not getting enough heat penetration into the centre of the bean....but I wouldnt know as I have no way to monitor the temp. :(
    What beans ?

    What volume ?

    How long did you rest them ?

    At what stage did you pull them.. Start or rolling SC ?

    What colour... Rosts look OK is very vauge

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,520

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    i was roasting with bowl-spoon-heatgun (no vac) and was getting ok roasts.

    they may not be "mindblowing" but never overly bitter unless i pull some bad shots....

  5. #5
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Thanks for the prompt replies.
    Dont have any photos as the beans have long since gone. Tried a mix of different beans from The Green Bean Bay. All looked to be evenly roasted between 8&9 on the card. All done in batches of 200 grm. or so from memory. Its been 6 mths since my failed efforts and have been getting my beans from the Brown Bay since, but noticed my bags of green beans sitting forlornly in the corner the other day and thought I really should try again.
    All my previous attempts were left to rest for at least 3 to 4 days and even tried them up to a fortnight later with no improvement.
    Will ahve another go soon as I get a chance but will take some pics this time.

  6. #6
    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    10,496

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Where are you Blaanchy?
    Maybe a local home roaster can show you the ropes.


  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,520

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    I just opened a bag and had a coffee from some Brazil beans i roasted about 4 days ago, at time of roast i did think to myself that i had roasted a bit quick between 1st crack and 2nd crack, the heat seemed to get away from me. done in my Corrretto

    I had attempted to get to 1st crack a bit quicker and think i did not back the heat off quick enough to slow the roast into 2ndCR.

    I would describe the taste as a bit bitter on the latte i had, but as its the 1st coffee from the bag I need to have a few more.

    So home roasters, if you ramp between 1st and 2nd crack to quick will it give you bitter coffee? Could help the OP next roast


  8. #8
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Internet
    Posts
    16,946
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????


    If your coffee is old it might (will) be bitter.
    If you over extract the shot it might (will) be bitter.

    If you under roast or roast too fast then it will prob be sour.

    Sour/bitter are very different and when reading on a forum and not tasting it can be tricky to get the answer right.
    8-)

  9. #9
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Andy, Not old, not over extracted (I only pull 15mm double ristrettos)
    I guess that means my coffee must be sour. I think you may have hit the nail right on the top.
    Did another roast this arvo, ramped the heat up quite slow, didnt crack for 30 mins, but it looks really even but I may have let it go a little too far if you can tell by chewing on a bean or two. Will let it rest a few days then let you know how it drinks.
    Thanks again for the input all.
    Cheers JB

  10. #10
    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    10,496

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    30 minutes is a bit long.

    Aim for about 15 next batch.

  11. #11
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Warwick, QLD
    Posts
    16,968

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Quote Originally Posted by 18161B1B141912036E635A0 link=1256536409/8#8 date=1256623616
    (I only pull 15mm double ristrettos)
    15ml Ristretto from a Double wont be getting the best out of the coffee either B49 :P... Aim for ~30ml/Double or ~15ml/Single and all should be good :)

    Mal.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Luke_G's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Northen Rivers
    Posts
    659

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Quote Originally Posted by 5B76727E731F0 link=1256536409/10#10 date=1256633906
    Aim for ~30ml/Double or ~15ml/Single and all should be good
    I spent a few hours at the local roasters shop a couple of weeks ago and there was an un named Sydney roaster there when it was my turn to pull shots for the crew and from a 21g basket, he wanted a 10mm restretto. The shot had barely hit the cup and he was frantically telling me to pull the cup out from underneith it... you could possibly immagine my WTF?!?! look i had on my face.

    anyway...sorry for getting off topic second crack, ill try not to let it happen again ;D

  13. #13
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Well, I could wait no longer. Just tried my last roast and I am pleased to report a moderate success. I realised at the time Id not gotten up to temp quickly enough and also that Id let it go a little too long. But, a massive improvement over my other efforts which were obviously under roasted on the inside. Tasted a little burnt, but not bad and no sign of the sour (which I mistook for bitter) results from my earlier attempts.
    Its renewed my enthusiasm to continue down the home roasters path. Thanks to all those who added their 2 cents worth.

    In regard to my love of the 15mm double shot, the reasoning behind that, for me anyway, is, less is more and more is less. Love the in your face hit, but too much of a good thing doesnt agree with my metabolism, so I limit myself to 1 brutal, but tiny shot after breakfast.

    Thanks again everyone.

    JB

  14. #14
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Internet
    Posts
    16,946
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????


    Glad you are getting some good results JB. It really can be done at home pretty well after you understand the variables and what difference a small change can make.

    re:15ml shots, sounds like you dont like the acidity (even if you hadnt pin pointed that as the symptom). I would select low acid beans to home roast, something like the wet hulled indos might suit your palate best and keep away from most of the African beans. (as a rough guide)

    Most of all keep experimenting and enjoy the journey.


  15. #15
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Warwick, QLD
    Posts
    16,968

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Quote Originally Posted by 49474A4A454843523F320B0 link=1256536409/12#12 date=1256782728
    In regard to my love of the 15mm double shot, the reasoning behind that, for me anyway, is, less is more and more is less. Love the in your face hit, but too much of a good thing doesnt agree with my metabolism, so I limit myself to 1 brutal, but tiny shot after breakfast.
    Brutal indeed JB.... ;D

    Great that everything is starting to come together mate; believe me, it just keeps getting better 8-)

    Cheers mate,
    Mal.

  16. #16
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Andy, Funny you should suggest I stay away from the African beans. Out of all the ones Ive tried from the Brown bay, they have been my favourite.........especially the Yemen Bani Ismail.......when you gettin some more of those ?????????
    JB

  17. #17
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Im with you JB--I dont like the high acid (tasting) beans but love the beans from Ethiopia, Rwanda and more.

    I dont appreciate Kenyan beans as a whole nor Tanzanian particularly. For me the high acid in these specific beans makes the milk taste sour.

    As always YMMV (your mileage may vary).

    Greg

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    759

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    beans with some acidity typically shine better through brewed methods. If theyre to go in to espresso you should probably roast them slower and a little darker.

    Horses for courses I say.

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    723

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    perhaps youre also not after caffeine or balance. a 15mm double ristretto would be thick, syrupy, choc/sugar/nutty with lots of body but very little caffeine.

    coffeevolumenazihorse

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    46

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    can someone please explain in laymans terms the process between first & second crack? im hearing this jargon for the first time so please go easy on me :)

    cheers guys

  21. #21
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    46

    Re: Why so bitter baby????????

    Behmor Coffee Roaster
    its ok i just read the manual explaining this...

    still i would love more pointers with regard to the behmor 1600 :)



Similar Threads

  1. BITTER COFFEE
    By superscooby009 in forum General Coffee Related...
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 31st January 2012, 05:39 PM
  2. Bitter coffee??
    By Dave_D in forum General Coffee Related...
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 21st February 2008, 04:58 PM
  3. Gaggia Baby dose and baby twin?
    By WSullivan in forum Brewing Equipment - Midrange ($500-$1500)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 15th January 2008, 04:53 PM
  4. Bitter and Sour
    By aaroned in forum General Coffee Related...
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 29th May 2007, 08:58 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •