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Thread: Corretto Batch Size - Heat Input Adjustments?

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    Corretto Batch Size - Heat Input Adjustments?

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi all
    About to start doing some regular roasting for some friends, so will be upping my batch size requirements. Currently I only do 350g for my personal usage, but I understand that doing double that is quite achievable in a corretto.

    My question is… are there any other snobbers who vary their batch sizes in the corretto regularly (rather than doing multiple back-to-back roasts), and if so, what are the ball park adjustments you have discovered are required?

    My guess is if I went to a 700g roast, I'd need to increase the temp early on to get more heat into the cold beans initially, then drop the temp more just before first crack so the roast doesn't run away. Does that sound right?

    Any advice much appreciated! (my first attempts will be this weekend one way or another - so I'll be sure to post my trial & error finding too!)

    Cheers Matt

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    I still do the odd 500 to 550g green for others. Definitely need more juice early on, 250 to 300deg starting temp on gun as opposed to 120 to 150 for my 300g batches.

    YES I find it more tricky to control on approach to FC. RFC can really get away from me if I'm not concentrating and being a bit more hands on with adjusting temps on gun.

    My pan is not insulated so I try to avoid any drastic changes with large temp changes on gun, I'd rather be slightly over in temp and let it settle, than end up chasing to avoid a stall.

    Having an insulated pan you should build up a pretty decent thermal mass.

    I'm honestly thinking of going back to bigger batches, when I nail them they seem to be just overall more wow than my smaller ones. I think if I insulated that could help with the smaller batches.

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    Thanks Steve
    Sounds like the gut reaction might be right. And I am looking forward to tasting the difference - I'm sure the larger batches, if I can control them well should be pretty flavoursome - that large thermal mass/less airflow must change things a bit…
    Will let you know how I get on!
    Matt

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    Hi Matt,
    I regularly change my roasting batch size depending on what and who I'm roasting for.
    I've pushed mine to 850g (green) a few times and very comfortable with 750g. I have a large rectangular bread bin tho.
    You are correct with your thoughts about more and less heat at the right times. You may also have to back the heat off between 1st and 2nd cracks.
    I found it was just experience with that amount of thermal mass to know when and how much to change the heat input.
    The things I found were:

    - insulating with fire blanket helped
    - cooler doesn't work as quick
    - beans expand in size and get closer to heat gun.
    My gun is at a fixed height, resting on the bread machine, and I change the heat input (bosch gun). The increase in bean volume is noticable for larger batch sizes and can get too close to the heat gun nozzle.

    I've considered a cover for the larger roast but haven't played with that yet.

    Good luck - I'm sure you wont spoil them.

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    Thanks Roubaix
    That's great info! I'm working with a medium (standard kinda size) rectangular pan, so doubt I could go to 850, but 700 should be possible. With the pan & lid insulated, my required heat inputs have dropped dramatically, so hopefully even with bean expansion causing the beans to getting closer to the gun, the lower temps would still prevent scorching, but guess we'll see :-)
    I'll be also to see whether the DMM still reads correctly with all the extra beans on top - might need to have varying holes dependent on batch size…?

    Matt

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    Hope its not off topic??

    On the physical limit side of things, I found that doing an 800g roast (only did that once) the beans started to escape over the top of the Roasting Pan as they expanded during the process.
    This encouraged me to raise the sides of the Pan and make a mental note that 600g should be the max for the Breville Oval Pan. (Internal mm H170 x W185 x D130). H includes the 30mm added by the extension.
    So that idea might be helpful ???

    I did quite a few 600g roasts with only a few escaping and then the added fact that 300g fits snuggly into the 250g bags is also a consideration.

    Cheers
    Sando

    Raised Sides on Pan.jpg

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    Hi Sando
    Yeah - there's a thought… My lid fits pretty snuggly right over the pan currently - so the main issue would be beans blocking/jumping out of the exhaust or input ports.
    I don't plan to go to 800, but 700 would be good… I guess I'll give it a go and see whether we end up with any "Steve McQueens" during the first run I had a laugh!

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    Well, that was an experience! Kinda like driving a semi trailer compared to a 998 Ducati!

    Here's the profile, plus temp inputs - a real mad hatters tea party! DMM readings all over the joint.
    BUT…
    I'll see how it cups this morning before making further comment… more tk


    20130607-EthCoop350-Java250-MMG100.jpg

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    Well I'll be!
    I jumped into that batch (Mocha Java + blend) today with 12 hours rest (hey - people are going to be paying for this!) in some flat whites - and amazing! Beautiful chocolate…
    I was expecting a disaster - but it blew me away. That much flavour so soon after roasting!
    I'll keep tweaking these larger batch sizes!
    Matt
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    Well 525g batch today. The DMM read much more accurately (fairly comparable to my normal profile) but still slower despite upping the temps 2 steps up on my ambient adjustments.
    But looking promising!

    Matt

    20130609-225Harrar-150SulBl-75Mex-75MMG.jpg

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    Gotta say DBC, I've been following your posts closely and am keen to replicate your technique and set up. Keep up the good work and I'll definitely be shooting you a PM soon.

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    Silly question and maybe off topic. Why and how do you insulate the pan?

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    Haven't done it myself but from countless thread reading a fire blanket supposedly works if wrapped around the actual breadpan and it is for keeping the needed temps of the gun down so as to avoid tipping/scorching and giving a better all over heat. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

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    Spot on Marcism ;-)
    I found I achieved a gentler, deeper, sweeter roast than without insulation, and with less heat input. I just used a fire blanket - wrapped and held it there with wire. Well worth it!
    Matt

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    Hah it's all the roasting I do in my dreams. Time to get building I think!

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcism View Post
    Gotta say DBC, I've been following your posts closely and am keen to replicate your technique and set up. Keep up the good work and I'll definitely be shooting you a PM soon.
    BTW Happy to help out if I can - PM when ready :-)

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    Well, here's an update. Just did a 700g roast last night, ambient - spannery! (around 3-4°).

    I've re-drilled the probe location in the pan about 20mm higher, which seems to have sorted the issue of the mis-reading probe (second crack came at 225° which is pretty normal, rather than the 217 of last batch).

    Also been playing with the input settings which brought back the roast length a few minutes - still have some tweaking to do though in this area.
    The area requiring most work IMHO is the first crack-second crack ramp, in slowing the roast - didn't drop it enough last night. The new probe location might help with doing this better - the first roast I did was all over the place, as when I dropped the temp and it seemed to stall - but could just be the probe reading right at the bottom of the bean mass so 'amplifying' (or de-amplifying!) the effect.

    One of the quirky things with the larger batch size is the definition of first crack. Normally I get first snap at 200° then into rolling first crack almost straight away and onto 210° - set your watch kinda thing. Last night - 1st snap about 190° - first crack started for real about 200° and rolled till 215° maybe? This is probably due the beans being hotter right under the gun than down the bottom of a bean mass. Not a huge issue - but just harder to log, as all the stages are slightly less defined.

    But will look forward to tasting the results in the cup… Here are the two past 700g profiles for comparison.

    Cheers!

    Matt


    BTW ran a "Coffee Appreciation" seminar over the weekend at a blokes church weekend away. Took the roaster and Diadema, did a batch with for about 15 fellas. Great fun! Lots of laughing (mainly at me!) but I think they all enjoyed the hilarious DIY nature of the process - then got to savour the results!

    20130607-EthCoop350-Java250-MMG100.jpg

    20130618-MochaJava-700g.jpg

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    This is interesting to see. I#m going to be looking for something around this batch size as well so keep on ironing out those kinks for me! :P Is your BM a big loaf type or the single paddle square type?

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    Hi Marcism
    Mines the medium size single paddle rectangular type - there are some pics in my profile album, if you wanted a look at the setup.
    It's been an interesting process - from what I've seen the results in the cup so far are much deeper & more cocoa-like with the larger batch sizes - while the same beans in the smaller batch sizes get more fruit or florals? I'm thinking that in some ways it amplified the results I achieved when I covered/insulated the pan - so the greater thermal mass gives a deeper roast, and the reduced air-flow also impacts I'm sure…
    More tk!

    Matt

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    Hi Matt,
    I soon got sick of the small roasts due to genetic laziness (not my fault, I blame the old man). I roast 630g in the same size set up as you and I agree with the comment about deeper choc flavour in the cup. My pan is not insulated and I start the roast @ 300 deg on the gun and start increasing at 10 deg increments when it stabilises at around 14 deg per minute up to about 500 deg on the heat gun to get it to 1st crack. I have the thermocouple fairly high in the pan and usually reach 1st crack between 195-200. That's where the difference comes in between the small and large roasts. Ramping down to achieve 3-4 deg rise to 2nd. It was much easier to control on the smaller roasts. From memory, I drop the heat gun 100 deg initially and then slowly reduce the temp to control the ramp. However, there are so many variables that come in to play that no two set-ups are the same.
    I've been roasting this way for over 2 years now and after trying various different profiles, I always seem to come back to this generic process. After all, the most important variable should never be overlooked and that is what you enjoy in your cup.
    The 630g roast yields about 520 in the bag and that lasts me a week (that's why the odd weight).
    It's good to hear about other people's journeys and tweaks. When the weather warms up my next project will be to pimp my corretto (the missus thinks I'm mad - she may be right but I think customising and spray painting a home made coffee roaster is perfectly reasonable).

    G.

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    Hi G
    Thanks for your feedback! Sounds like we're getting similar results. I've always found the ramping to first crack works well too.
    Just a query - with the inputs you're using, how long does your roast stretch? The first one I did (which was a cracker in the cup) was around 22mins - I'm just not sure whether to try and pull it back to my more usual 17min smaller batch size profile - or just work with a longer roast expectation?

    Matt

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    I usually reach 1st by 14 minutes and end at the first cracks of 2nd 5-6 minutes later so my profile is similar to yours. I have tried shortening and lengthening the time and many other variables but I keep coming back to this profile. I am roasting a 2 bean mix at the moment (equal parts Brazil pulped naturals and Peru ceja de selva) and the results definitely suit my taste buds.

    Just remembered, I'm out. Better go and crank up the Corretto!

    G.

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    Today's Roast

    Here is the roast I just did and the equipment and the result

    G.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Wow.
    I'm amazed you can get a climb like that - with my 700g batch I was up to 600 on the gun at the end and still pushing to get 22mins!
    I guess that's the ambient, humidity & altitude combined with batch size. Don't know if I'll be able to match my smaller size profile without scorching or tipping - so just keep playing till it works I guess :-)

    Matt

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    Well, just cracked into my latest 700g batch.
    What has really surprised me is how a blend you thought you knew well can change characteristics sooo much just with the batch size! My latest MochaJava roast is sensational. Still a bit longer in the profile than I would have expected/desired for a smaller batch size - but in the cup is thick, rich chocolate - and with much more depth than I have achieved in the same blend in smaller batch sizes. Less defined, I suppose, but oodles of flavour.
    If I was going to try hypothesising, I'd think these larger, slower batch roasts are ideal for the indo/africans where you want think rich & earthy, with maybe the smaller lighter, slightly faster roasts better for highlight beans with a bit of zing - such as the centrals.

    Anyway, my thought for the day… :-)
    Happy roasting!

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    Interesting.
    That latest 700g roast, while maintaining big choc in a FW, is a much brighter and more acidic doppio than the early longer one. No surprise really, being a steeper ramp and faster roast than the first, but at 21mins I would still from a flavour balance point of view be looking to stretch it back out a bit. So I might need to reset my roast length expectations (and my RM preferences - I'm running out of room on the profile!) to incorporate these larger roasts.
    I'll be looking to head back towards 22mins with a slightly slower ramp to second crack…
    A work in progress to be sure!

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    It's interesting isn't it. I have been doing the same thing, keep stretching out my roasts more and more. I'm generally in the 21 to 22min as well. As you know plenty of acidity to go around. I'm thinking how much would I have to really stretch out the malliard zone and the time between first and second crack to have dominant baking flavours?

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    Yeah - not sure I've ever really experienced baked roasts. Had plenty of burnt, bitter ones though!
    I'm surprised that it seems to be much less about the final CS colour - and much more about how you got there! All of my roasts are dropped just on second crack - all CS8-9ish, but the difference in flavour is massive depending on the early ramp. You can go from bright & acidic to deep cocoa - in one bean - all with the same final drop temp/colour. Can't see why you'd need to go to CS11 unless you liked oily, ashy flavours!

    Here's my latest 700g batch from last night. Might still slow first crack-second crack down a bit, but I'm thinking this is getting close to where I'm aiming at… but the results in the cup will be the decider!

    20130628-300harrar200java100ieh100mex.jpg


    Also trying a slower than normal 350g batch of El Sal Aida (part of my other SO experiment!) - so will see what that does too…


    20130629-400gElSalAida-SlowRamp2-1C.jpg


    Happy roasting!
    Matt

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    Hi all
    Update on the 700g batch size technique adjustment process. Just done a beautiful (no, let's say spectacular!) KJM style blend in the bigger batch size. Got a much smoother profile. Still stretched out to around 23mins, but aroma just explodes off the grinder and smooth, sweet and flavoursome in the cup, both as a FW and doppio. Getting there!

    The one main difference with this batch was I pre-warmed the pan to 200° on the DMM, then dumped in the greens. Just allowed me to still use the lower temps during the ramp while still reducing the overall time a minute or too. Come to think of it, my very first attempt was in a hot pan from an earlier roast - so makes sense. This is quite a similar profile to that first, scary attempt!

    The following two profiles show the difference pre-warming make with this bigger batch size - the first is the current great KJM batch with pan pre-warmed to 200° then green dumped in, then the second is a later Mocha Java Plus with only gentle prewarm (to 30°) which shows how much longer the roast took with the same ambient roast ramp technique…

    More tk on this later roast…
    Matt


    20130710-KJM-700g.jpg

    20130715-350ugandan-250waghi-100mmg.jpg
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    Update: The KJM batch is almost done - it's been brilliant! Lovely deep, rich cocoa both in a dopp and flat white today - fairly long rest, but well worth the wait!
    I think the profile is around about right now for that batch size
    We'll see how the MJ+ batch worked when I crack it tomorrow or the next day…
    Matt

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    Ooooh sounds delicious! That preheat is huge, no issues with scorching?

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcism View Post
    Ooooh sounds delicious! That preheat is huge, no issues with scorching?
    No - none at all. The pre-heat actually allows for a lower gun temp throughout the roast, reducing the risk of scorching. And although the DMM reads 200° before the bean drop, I doubt that the pan would be that hot - and even radiant temp of that amount would be unlikely to scorch that amount of cold bean mass - I think overall the temp would equalise pretty quick
    Was going to try another roast tonight, test the new juice bottle bean hopper - but ambient in the garage was about 2° - so might wait till tomorrow when the cold front's past!

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    Well, really settled down into the zone with batch size for a 700g roast - and a good pre-heat & stretching out the roast further seems to be the key. This Mocha Java Combo I'm currently drinking is spectacular. I actually did a 700g MJ then a 350g Peru / Central roast, which I stretched out a bit longer than my normal 350g roast to further soften the acidity. Then did a post roast blend. But you'll see the difference in time - 22mins for the smaller and 26mins for the bigger.
    Beautiful cocoa from day 1 - but certainly not dark/oily. Great espresso, awesome through soy as a FW.
    Very happy!

    Happy roasting all
    Matt


    20130817-14degAmb-700gMJ.jpg

    20130817-peru200elsal150.jpg

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    That second profile is starting to like like what I know as a Seattle roast;
    slowing the RoR through Maillard, then picking it up again 'til finish.
    Do you notice any difference to the appearance of the roasted bean? Are they shinier (but not oily)?

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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    That second profile is starting to like like what I know as a Seattle roast;
    slowing the RoR through Maillard, then picking it up again 'til finish.
    Do you notice any difference to the appearance of the roasted bean? Are they shinier (but not oily)?
    I started developing that profile when I read somewhere that the sugars develop in the mallards zone (150-160) so I slowed the roast by upping the temp at 150° ready for my next ramp (which I do at 160° on the DMM) but slowing the fan at the same time. Stretches it out by about 1min in that zone. Did some early back to back testing, and it certainly did seem to be smoother & sweeter.
    As the the appearance - that is a real can of worms! I wouldn't say noticably shinier? Certainly not oily - need to have a closer look…

    But what has been fascinating with all these experiments is to see just how much flavour difference can be achieved without taking the roast darker, ie into rolling second crack (ie no dark CS10 roasts). I normally drop all my beans at 224°. I've recently done a batch where I ran too quickly from first crack-second crack but same drop temp - the beans were lighter colour and more sour. But equally, I've found that by stretching out overall the length of the roast from first crack-second crack, you can remove acidity from say a central - without actually going any darker (or shinier?) in colour :-)

    Still learning!
    Matt

    This was the 700g runaway roast…

    20130804-250png200kis150java50mex50mmg.jpg

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    Hey Matt some interesting looking developments to your profiles!

    I have been aiming for the following as my generic profile last couple of months. Anything from 450g to 600g green, usually a 40 - 50% Brazil base plus Mocha Java. The milk only drinkers seem to really like it, I take it a bit further approaching rolling second crack for my sisters super automatic and it actually makes a semi decent coffee you pull 3 really short shots with milk.

    I am generally happy with the balance I get roasting all the different SO I have stocked up. Seems to preserve just enough of the origin characteristics and acidity, while still having heaps of body and sweetness and a smooth malty, caramel or chocolate/cocoa finish depending on the bean. I am drinking a lot more espresso these days, mostly on LP lever and really starting to notice the differences small adjustments / intended or otherwise make on the end product. Slightly hotter at the start, slightly cooler more gentle start and as you mentioned the time and heat between 1st and 2nd crack.

    Happy roasting to all.

    BelBrazilblend500g.jpg

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    Hi Steve
    Yeah - amazing how you and up tuning your roasting to your machine and tastes!
    I'm doing more MJ + base roasts too - trying it over a PNG base which is really sweet a caramel. Will need to try some southerns again - early on found the brasil or columbinas really a bit bland as SO's - but I haven't been able to find a true syruppy sweet body with anything else - so maybe that is what's missing? (hence the reason there seem to be lots of espresso blends with a brasil base!).
    I'm surprised that you can get a ramp and 17min roast like that from a 500g batch - with 700g I had to really nail the gun to the rafters to achieve anywhere near sub 20min times - and then they came out sour! Those long roasts seem the sweet balance point. I suspect that the low humidity & high altitude out here has a lot more impact than I really understand - I have read that high humidity leads to faster roasting as the water transfers heat into the bean more quickly. Other coastal roasters with very similar setups to mine seem to use much lower gun settings…

    I might try the faster start / mallards slow for a 700g batch next - see if that makes a difference with the bigger batches.

    BTW Greatly enjoying a MJ blend of Uganda + Java (Sando got me onto the Uganda!) - it's a cracker! Right up there with the Tanz Uru & Eth Sidamo :-)

    Matt

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    The different climates is an interesting variable. My heat gun temps go something like this, pre heat is 230 - 250 depending on weather.
    After TP and everything settles down I will ramp the HG up anywhere between 20 - 50 increments to obtain the desired ramp.
    On approach to FC it will be somewhere between 480 - 520, its rare that I have had to go any higher than this, no surprise that it would have been on a cold and blustery day.

    I get very hands on between FC and SC, temps are 380 - 430, no big adjustments trying to maintain 3 - 5 deg/min rise.

    The Uganda is in my top 3 or 4 from BeanBay so far, incredible value and more than holds its own as SO. I have used it as 60% base with Guatemala Jacaltenango and Sulawesi Tana Toraja making up the other 40% in equal amounts and its incredible!

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    Interesting :-)
    If you look at the runaway roast, my gun temps are quite close to yours by the sounds (550 at first crack) - but still took 24mins! Ambient was 14 deg though - and many of my recent roast have ambient between 0-10deg :-)
    Have to try that Uganda blend - I often do a MJ+, which is something like 45/35/20 Ug/Java/Central - that sounds interesting :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    That second profile is starting to like like what I know as a Seattle roast;
    slowing the RoR through Maillard, then picking it up again 'til finish.
    Do you notice any difference to the appearance of the roasted bean? Are they shinier (but not oily)?
    Holy Toledo Batman!
    Did two roasts yesterday, adding in the "Seattle Dip" as I mentioned - and whoa! Right out of the park! Cracked one this morning (one day rest!) a Mocha Java on a PNG Base, and was punched in the face by caramel! I've done this blend before with the standard 700g roast, and its been lovely caramel but subtle - but this dip seemed to take the good bits and triple-strength them! There does seem to be some additional 'shinyness' to the beans - the standard are quite dry looking, these are certainly not oily, but more polished? Could be all smoke & mirrors though… but can't argue with the cup!

    Updates to follow as the beans age, and as doppio (this was in a FW). Here is the two profiles (the second was a back-to-back roast, hence the slightly faster start with same settings, despite the initial pre-warm - will adjust guns temps next time to compensate)…

    Cheers Matt

    20130824-Caramello-rested.jpg


    20130824-PNGWaghi-SeattleDip.jpg

  41. #41
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Never heard of this referred to as the "Seattle Dip" before but I have seen something very similar in a Willem Boot article I read a long time ago but I forget how he referred to it....

    Mal.

  42. #42
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimal View Post
    Never heard of this referred to as the "Seattle Dip" before but I have seen something very similar in a Willem Boot article I read a long time ago but I forget how he referred to it....

    Mal.
    Yeah - that was a DBC special, inspired by chokkidog! Hey, if you can't make up your own scientific terms on CS - where else can you! Not going to get published anywhere else :-)

    I got the idea from an old thread about stretching out the Mallards reaction zone (150-160) to increase to developments of the sugars (that may well have come form Willem :-) - and it seemed to work well on my smaller roasts, but the effect on these bigger roasts was startling!
    It is the closest to a commercial style roast i've achieved so far for ooomph and aroma. The only thing I noticed this morning as a doppio was that it had a little sharpness at the back, which I would normally equate by taking it a little too far into second crack. And in reality, in those two roasts second crack came on a few degrees earlier - I could have dropped quite happily at 222° - there was a fair bit of rolling rice bubbles by the 224° drop point. So this might allow me to achieve the potency while roasting lighter :-)
    One other effect - these beans will need more resting! The gentle roast are a very stable pour from day 1 - these are quite explosive! Same time, same drop point. Must be the more aggressive profile - more energy in = more energy out? - odd…

    I'm impressed though by the effects!
    Matt

  43. #43
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    That second profile is starting to like like
    Like like?? seriously?? Missed that one, sorry ;-) should read 'look like'

  44. #44
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    I took a few kilos of beans and did a few roasts with the guy I bought my roaster from.
    It was he who showed me what he called the 'Seattle Roast' profile. It could well have appeared on the Boot/Roast Mag site
    but unfortunately it appears that some of the articles available open source from him have been deleted,
    it may have been there somewhere. Not much reference anywhere else on the web, that is easily found.

    I now use a modified version and I have found the same results, pretty much, including dropping the roast a little earlier, by temp but not time.
    I have asked about the increased sheen to the bean but don't have a definitive answer.
    In the cup there is a pronounced sweetness and clarity of flavours.
    Even the roastery smells sweeter and more caramel/vanilla after a roast day.....mmmmmm.....nice :-D.

  45. #45
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    In the cup there is a pronounced sweetness and clarity of flavours.
    Even the roastery smells sweeter and more caramel/vanilla after a roast day.....mmmmmm.....nice :-D.
    I second that :-)
    There does seem to be much more pronounced flavour - the standard ramp is more muted & subtle.
    And as to aroma - even the beans in the bag seem to smell better? Sometimes you can get beans that smell a bit average in the bag, but grind and taste great, but these excel at all four stages - roast, bag, grind and "post-brew" level. Wins all around!

    Just out of interest - what sort of roaster do you use?
    Matt

  46. #46
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    5kg Has Garanti :-)

  47. #47
    Life-long Learner DesigningByCoffee's Avatar
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    Noooice :-)
    I'm trying to consider some bigger options (starting to roast regularly for 4-5 others) but don't know if I can quite stretch to that yet!
    Might be ganged BM's on the bench!
    Matt
    chokkidog likes this.

  48. #48
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    There seems to be a market potential for a home/shop roaster (but I would never put one that small in a shop) around the 2.5-3kg mark it's not funny. ;-D
    It's just that the threshold requirements for a good machine; motors, fans, drums, bearings
    wiring and fuel components and compliance all add up and push the price accordingly.

    If one could be produced in the $5k bracket, or thereabouts..................

    cheers

  49. #49
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DesigningByCoffee View Post
    I second that :-)
    There does seem to be much more pronounced flavour - the standard ramp is more muted & subtle.
    And as to aroma - even the beans in the bag seem to smell better? Sometimes you can get beans that smell a bit average in the bag, but grind and taste great, but these excel at all four stages - roast, bag, grind and "post-brew" level. Wins all around!
    Absolutely agree with all of that...

    Just opening a bag to pour into the grinder gets the taste buds tingling. Longevity is another biggy... Amazing how long the peak flavour plateau lasts for too. Always beautiful coffee right down to the last bean in the bag...

    Mal.

  50. #50
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Behmor Coffee Roaster
    Just checked your profiles Matt from post #40 ( I've been a little busy ).
    Isn't it amazing how seemingly subtle changes to a profile can have such profound effects?!
    It also demonstrates how valuable the RM software is. I particularly like (apart from the obvious)
    the RoR graph along the bottom, it's a great help in understanding the effects of heat and air input changes and how the roast dynamics are trending.
    It's been very useful when developing profiles.
    Now, if only I could get my head around the code thing......... :-D



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