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Thread: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

  1. #1
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    Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi there,

    Is there anyone using Rancilio Silvia v3 here? I got mine a month ago and had problems in frothing milk with its 3 hole steam wand. Changing from a bell shaped pitcher to a straight walled one does help but still got hot milk at the bottom. I find it difficult to position the wand correctly since the steam comes out in 3 different directions. So what I got is only a withered rosetta like this (too much liquid milk).

    Any suggestions are much appreciated.

    Thanks!



  2. #2
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    change it back (to a one hole, old silvia tip) or practice

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Yeah thats what I intend to do but the old silvia tip wont fit the v3 wand. It seems the market doesnt have the tip yet. If you know any website selling the tip, appreciate if you can let me know.

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    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Have you tried this method
    See post #1 for the written instructions and view a video on post #30

    http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1220959662

    KK

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Thanks KK! I am using Rancilio Silvia v3 with 3 hole. Actually I saw a similar technique on Home Barista and tried it this morning with a 600ml pitcher, but only got stiff foam on top and hot milk at bottom. Maybe I should use a smaller pitcher and try it out again tomorrow.

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Are you getting the whirlpool when steaming?

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    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Quote Originally Posted by 5F574F5D494E494F3C0 link=1245030008/4#4 date=1245651938
    Thanks KK! I am using Rancilio Silvia v3 with 3 hole. Actually I saw a similar technique on Home Barista and tried it this morning with a 600ml pitcher, but only got stiff foam on top and hot milk at bottom. Maybe I should use a smaller pitcher and try it out again tomorrow.
    Try it again with a 300 ml jug once that is mastered then you can move up to a larger vessel

    Practice is your friend
    KK


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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    This morning I tried using a 300ml pitcher and got a very nice layer of microfoam, which is very smooth and never achieved before. But the bottom is hot milk. I already put the milk in the freezer for a while. After aerating and putting the wand in the middle for about 10 sec, I moved it to the spout until the pitcher gets real hot. Did I miss anything?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip



    Quote Originally Posted by 454D554753545355260 link=1245030008/7#7 date=1245727784
    I already put the milk in the freezer for a while
    I use my milk straight out of the fridge

    Quote Originally Posted by 454D554753545355260 link=1245030008/7#7 date=1245727784
    But the bottom is hot milk
    It should be hot milk but very mildly aerated.

    More steam time will make the the already foamed milk harden and bubble as the hot milk on the bottom migrates up adding itself to the foam mass

    KK





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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    I have to say, I struggled with the 3 holes tip for a while as well. *What I did that improve my milk texturing skills are....

    :: Preparing the steam ::

    1) Turn the steam switch on...wait for it to go off, then purge until the steam is dry.

    After purging, (not sure if this applies to everyone but this is the case for me) my 09 Silvia runs out of steam very quickly. *Notice how weak the steam is at this point comparing to when you start purging..

    2) Flick on and off the brew switch (DO NOT turn off steam switch at this point)! *Do this until the boiler light turns on again.
    *- This will do two things, fill up the boiler, and produces more steam!!

    3) Wait until the boiler light goes off (some say start steaming while the light is on)... purge a bit more just to make sure the steam arm is clear of water.

    (If you’re getting weak steam, then the above process is very important!!)


    :: Milk texturing ::

    1) Notice the direction of the 3 holes... *You want to adjust the steam wand in a way that, two of the holes are facing forward in the direction you want the milk to swirl...otherwise, the milk momentum will be weak and it will be hard to get the swirl going (no swirl = no micro foam)... You can experiment with this, I did noticed varying differences when changing the holes direction.

    2) Same as in KKs guide, use 90 degree wand, up right jug. *Aim the wand to one side of the Jug. *Turn steam knob to full power.

    3) After few seconds (2-4), when turbulence is forming. Tilt the Jug forward (away from you), giving it small angle. *You want the steam to be pushing towards the bottom of the jug where there is less milk. *(the steam tip is near the top of the Jug or about half way).
    - You should be introducing air/bubble at this point... and dont worry if you see some big bubbles.
    - Note: the milk is starting to swirl faster and faster

    4) Once you have got enough foam (for cappuccino/latte), you MUST SINK the wand deep into the milk. *This is how you can get the micro foam. *
    - I for a while did not sink the wand and got what you described “hot milk at the bottom”.

    5) Clean the steam wand thoroughly! *You can now Tap and swirl your Jug to get rid of any remaining bubbles… Ta Daaaa…


    - Important points to note

    * Must wait for the machine to produce enough steam…
    * Must get the swirl going…
    * Must Sink the wand…

  11. #11
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    SPL.G, what sort of time frame is this process taking? i have no experience with the 09 model, just curious, are you producing better microfoam now than you have with a one hole?
    as i said meaning no offense, just wondering :)

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    The only time Ive used the 08 Silvia was when I did the training with Di Bartoli. *For me, it felt much easier with the one hole than with the three holes. *With the process I described, I can get as good micro foam as when I did during the course. *Time to boil two rounds of steam + texturing the milk is around 3 minutes. *Not that ideal but, I have no choice :(


    Id be interested in hearing how other 09 Silvia owner tackle this issue.

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Thanks SPL.G for sharing your experiences. Some of the points do make sense to me, like moving the wand close to pitcher wall to "block" one hole and make the steam outburst more manageable. But I never think sinking the wand is important since there are a lot of articles out there saying just to put the steam tip a bit beneath the milk surface.

    In any case, I will give it a try tomorrow. By how deep the wand should be sunk into the milk?

    As a side note, I am also using Silvia v3 and find the steam very powerful. I am not sure if this differs machine to machine. Before frothing, I usually bleed the wand twice and still find there is a lot of steam coming out. For inexperienced user, the powerful steam can be a problem as we cannot take our time to texture the milk. Things just happen so fast that like within 45 sec the milk becomes so hot the frothing process has to stop no matter we get microfoam or not. With single hole tip, this process takes longer which makes it easier to spend enough time to first stretching and then texturing.

  14. #14
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Do sink the tip just so it stops drawing in air from the surface once the temperature of the milk reaches 30° to 40°C.

    If the tip is removable you can thread some stainless or copper wire through the holes to reduce the volume of steam and increase its velocity to make the stretching easier.

    And...45 seconds!! 45 seconds is forever. My VBM Piccolo steams the milk I use in about 5 seconds, my Diadema is a bit slower--it takes about 7. You have TONS of time.

    Greg

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    My milk frothing process takes about 30 seconds... *(for one cup).

    Greg is right, sink the tip to stop drawing more air, so sink it just enough so you don’t introduce any more air but make sure the milk doesnt scream, you will know once you hear that sound... This also fine tune the bubbles you have into micro foam.

    For the steam power... are you getting the same amount of steam as when you started bleeding say... 10-20 seconds after turning the steam on full power? *I believe the 3 holes consume three times more steam as it did with the one hole. *Theoretically the steam should run out three times faster.. The wand size is also roughly 2-3 times bigger than the old wand in diameter size to support the amount of steam required by the three holes. *So I guess this explains why the steam ran out so quickly for me.. *(I cannot steam the milk back to back without re-boiling for more steam)

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    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    This an answer I gave recently about depth of wand in the milk

    Regarding the milk foam

    Always start with cold milk and the right size jug
    The position of the wand in the milk jug is important for developing volume and texture

    For best volume e.g. Cappuccino, it should sit just below the surface (up to the bulbous tip joining the steam pipe)

    For best texture e.g. latte art, it is better to be slightly deeper (up to the bulbous tip join + 10mm up the steam pipe)

    It is important to position the steam wand differently for different coffee drinks.
    Hope it helps CK

    KK

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Thanks for all of your suggestions! Today I gave it another shot and posted a video. It seems the amount of foam gets better with less milk at bottom but there is stiff bubble on top. Perhaps I have put the wand too close to the surface.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE_tFL_eC2I

    Here is the rosetta I tried to make. It doesnt look like one, does it?



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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    1) Hohoho... too much angle I think...
    2) You gave it way too much air.. (sink the wand)
    3) The wand isnt at 90 degree by the look of it.. *
    4) Use both hands, your Jug is wobbling everywhere....

    When I suggested give it small angle... I meant small angle same as when you started frothing... *so maybe you can give it another shot. with everything straight to start off with. *then tilt the jug slightly forward.

    Remember to sink the wand as well.. *you gave it air for the whole one minute ...... *:o I thought 45seconds was long already.. hehehe. *If you prepared your steam properly, all this should be done in less than 30 seconds.. *I did another cup today and was all done in 15-20 seconds..

    5) Get yourself a thermometer :P

    Back to Rugby.. Go the NSW!

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    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Quote Originally Posted by 544046465C50574052525454350 link=1245030008/17#17 date=1245842512
    Back to Rugby.. Go the NSW!
    Sorry they lost to QLD ::)

    Quote Originally Posted by 565E465440474046350 link=1245030008/16#16 date=1245832150
    Perhaps I have put the wand too close to the surface
    Did you read my post about wand depth ?

    KK

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Today I got pretty good result with the foam hanging onto the wall of pitcher when spinning it. I think what I was missing before is holding the pitcher with two hands, which help stabilize the jug and get the necessary whirlpool action.

    Swirling is extremely important to get the microfoam. Depending on how you hold the pitcher, one has to find a position which makes the whirlpool possible. Even if I made some big bubbles at the beginning, the whirlpool can help eliminate them, which is quite in contrary to what some of the articles have said.

    When pouring, the foam started floating to the top too soon, when the cup is just half filled. Perhaps i need to fine tune my latte art technique and probably my cup is a bit too big.

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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    Quote Originally Posted by 767E667460676066150 link=1245030008/19#19 date=1245902333
    Today I got pretty good result with the foam hanging onto the wall of pitcher when spinning it. I think what I was missing before is holding the pitcher with two hands, which help stabilize the jug and get the necessary whirlpool action.

    Swirling is extremely important to get the microfoam. Depending on how you hold the pitcher, one has to find a position which makes the whirlpool possible. Even if I made some big bubbles at the beginning, the whirlpool can help eliminate them, which is quite in contrary to what some of the articles have said.
    Try swirling the jug with it resting on the bench; that eliminates any up and down motion and should result in movement of the jug in only the horizontal plane.
    Works for me.

  22. #22
    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Re: Problem with new Rancilio Silvia 2009 3 hole steam tip

    If its coming out nice but stiff
    That could be that the steaming is to long

    Also try starting the process from the centre of the jug & slowly moving to the side

    KK



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