Results 1 to 49 of 49
Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By cherni78
  • 1 Post By GregWormald

Thread: 3 months, still no good microfoam! Help

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76

    3 months, still no good microfoam! Help

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi guys,

    Yes, I've read all threads on this, but still not good... Frustrating!

    Equipment: EM6910 setting max temp and wettest.
    Milk: 1st try Devondale Skinny, 2nd try Devondale Semi-skin (the ones that not in the fridge)

    So, I end up with microfoam, but its at the top of the milk... the rest of the milk when I pour does not have that creammy look... Latte art is merely impossible.

    Its like the micrfoam is not mixed with all the milk.

    am I missing something?

    Thanks in advance folks!

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    How soon after you've steamed the milk do you pour??

    The thing with skinny or semi-skinny milk is that the foam likes to separate from the bulk of the milk fairly quickly, which leads to what you described.

    Be sure to constantly "swirl"/"swish" the stretched milk in the jug until you pour (i.e. as soon as it's steamed, make small circles with your milk jug in hand).

    Having said that, it's hard to say for sure what's going on with seeing you in action. If you post a video up, we could certainly diagnose most things further.

    Hope this helps.
    -Aaron

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronpratt View Post
    How soon after you've steamed the milk do you pour??

    The thing with skinny or semi-skinny milk is that the foam likes to separate from the bulk of the milk fairly quickly, which leads to what you described.

    Be sure to constantly "swirl"/"swish" the stretched milk in the jug until you pour (i.e. as soon as it's steamed, make small circles with your milk jug in hand).

    Having said that, it's hard to say for sure what's going on with seeing you in action. If you post a video up, we could certainly diagnose most things further.

    Hope this helps.
    -Aaron
    Hi Aaron! Good idea, will do a lattee today and post a video.

    I do swirl the milk... still looks like the microfoam is all up...

    Let me check! Cheers!
    johnthepom0 likes this.

  4. #4
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288
    IMO everything is more critical with skinny milk and there is very little room for error.

    Try with high quality full milk, or a drop of two of dishwashing liquid in water to see if your technique actually works.

    Greg
    fred0 likes this.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by GregWormald View Post
    IMO everything is more critical with skinny milk and there is very little room for error.

    Try with high quality full milk, or a drop of two of dishwashing liquid in water to see if your technique actually works.

    Greg
    Dishwashing? or could it be any detergent?

  6. #6
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288
    Dishwashing liquid works. Don't know about any others.

    Greg

  7. #7
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,116
    Quote Originally Posted by GregWormald View Post
    Dishwashing liquid works. Don't know about any others.
    Yes, but does it taste any good Greg?

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    I had a laugh!

    Well, It looks like with detergent I can get pretty good microfoam! I think I'll start serving my deterngen-latte

    One of the issues I find is that I am stretching too much the milk and when I pour, a lot of foam comes down... making impossible to make latte art.

    Any tips on when to stop the stretching?

    Cheers!

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    249
    From what you're describing it sounds like full cream milk might solve your issues. Sounds like your skim is separating before you pour.. which happens quite often. Give full cream a try and see if you have some more success..

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    Quote Originally Posted by cherni78 View Post
    I had a laugh!

    One of the issues I find is that I am stretching too much the milk and when I pour, a lot of foam comes down... making impossible to make latte art.

    Any tips on when to stop the stretching?

    Cheers!
    Hi Cherni,

    In terms of when to stop stretching, it really comes down to your technique of how much you stretch it from the word go; i.e. do you stretch it with "big bubbles" for the first 10 seconds, or slowly stretch it for 30 seconds?? Either way, it's really tough to give guidance. This is one of those things you'll need to test again and again until you get it right. For instance, you're finding you're stretching it too much, so next time try stretching it slower in the same time frame of stretching and see what happens. Still don't like it? try again with a shorter time frame and see what happens. Milk stretching, along with everything coffee, is something you need to slowly fine tune until it meets you're desired level.

    Still, a video would help a lot I had a laugh

    Hope this helps again.

    Cheers,
    Aaron

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronpratt View Post
    Hi Cherni,

    In terms of when to stop stretching, it really comes down to your technique of how much you stretch it from the word go; i.e. do you stretch it with "big bubbles" for the first 10 seconds, or slowly stretch it for 30 seconds?? Either way, it's really tough to give guidance. This is one of those things you'll need to test again and again until you get it right. For instance, you're finding you're stretching it too much, so next time try stretching it slower in the same time frame of stretching and see what happens. Still don't like it? try again with a shorter time frame and see what happens. Milk stretching, along with everything coffee, is something you need to slowly fine tune until it meets you're desired level.

    Still, a video would help a lot I had a laugh

    Hope this helps again.

    Cheers,
    Aaron

    Hi Aaron!

    Sorry for the delay... here is the Vid. Is in two parts (my fiance was filming)



    And this is the end product:



    What am I doing wrong?

    The steam settings in the EM6910 are +10 in temp and +0.02 in pump (Dry).

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    51
    Try the "driest" steam setting. For steaming milk we're after steam that's as dry as possible.

    And by watching your video, it seems that you over-stretched the milk (i.e. creating a nice foamy head floating on top of the milk) and also created too much big bubbles that didn't get incorporated.

    My suggestions:
    1. Try lowering the wand by just a tiny bit to get more of a "tchk tchk tchk" and less of the "tchssssk tchk tchk tchssssk" sound (don't know how to explain this properly :P). the long "tchssssk" sound means the wand is a tiny weeny bit too high which creates more big bubbles.

    2. Try dipping the wand at around the 28 seconds mark and move the wand to one side to really swirl the milk. You started dipping the wand at around the 38 seconds mark and there's probably too much stiff foam at the top already to be mixed into the milk properly.

    3. Also try doing the initial stretching part with the wand closer to one side of the jug so you're stretching + spinning the milk to start incorporating microfoam into the milk right from the beginning. I find this method quite effective with my Breville BarVista with bugger-all steam power.

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Try looking at it like this -

    Steam temp controls how long it takes the milk to warm, steam pump controls how powerful the swirling effect is. the whole dry/wet thing is deceiving.

    To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement. Try this -

    As you look down at the milk divide the "circle" in to imaginary quarters. Put the wand in as far as the join between the stem and tip in the lower top left "quarter" (about the 9 o'clock line) with the jug tilted slightly away from the machine. Open the valve and get the milk spinning without any air going in. This only takes a few seconds - then lower the jug until you get the "hiss" of the air entering the milk. If you have a thermo introduce air to 25C, if by hand go until the jug loses its cold edge, then lift the jug so the tip is back where you started. Work on keeping the tip absolutely still , only moving the jug if the swirling milk is in danger of causing more air to be sucked in.

    Hope that helps some.

    C.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    Quote Originally Posted by oble89 View Post
    Try the "driest" steam setting. For steaming milk we're after steam that's as dry as possible.
    This is usually the case, however from experience with the EM6910 the wettest setting seems to be the ideal; it tends to keep the mil

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement.
    Agreed! This is you're main problem by far. When you stretch the milk, perhaps the most important thing is to make sure that what you're stretching actually gets spread throughout the milk, which is achieved by either rolling the milk, or by the whirlpool effect (WE). I typically use the WE; it's fairly easy and works a treat.

    Essentially all the WE is is positioning the steam tip in such a way as to create a little whirlpool action in the milk. Once you've got your whirlpool going THEN slowly start to lower your milk jug to get the stretching, making sure the whirlpool keeps going. Once you've stretched enough lower the tip deeper into the milk, again ensuring that whirlpool keeps going (this is so that the foam doesn't separate) until it's up to temperature.

    Again, hope this helps.
    -Aaron

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronpratt View Post
    This is usually the case, however from experience with the EM6910 the wettest setting seems to be the ideal; it tends to keep the mil



    Agreed! This is you're main problem by far. When you stretch the milk, perhaps the most important thing is to make sure that what you're stretching actually gets spread throughout the milk, which is achieved by either rolling the milk, or by the whirlpool effect (WE). I typically use the WE; it's fairly easy and works a treat.

    Essentially all the WE is is positioning the steam tip in such a way as to create a little whirlpool action in the milk. Once you've got your whirlpool going THEN slowly start to lower your milk jug to get the stretching, making sure the whirlpool keeps going. Once you've stretched enough lower the tip deeper into the milk, again ensuring that whirlpool keeps going (this is so that the foam doesn't separate) until it's up to temperature.

    Again, hope this helps.
    -Aaron
    Thanks guys! Will try today!!! And film again

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Try looking at it like this -

    Steam temp controls how long it takes the milk to warm, steam pump controls how powerful the swirling effect is. the whole dry/wet thing is deceiving.

    To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement. Try this -

    As you look down at the milk divide the "circle" in to imaginary quarters. Put the wand in as far as the join between the stem and tip in the lower top left "quarter" (about the 9 o'clock line) with the jug tilted slightly away from the machine. Open the valve and get the milk spinning without any air going in. This only takes a few seconds - then lower the jug until you get the "hiss" of the air entering the milk. If you have a thermo introduce air to 25C, if by hand go until the jug loses its cold edge, then lift the jug so the tip is back where you started. Work on keeping the tip absolutely still , only moving the jug if the swirling milk is in danger of causing more air to be sucked in.

    Hope that helps some.

    C.
    So its putting air till 25 C and then lift?

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    Quote Originally Posted by cherni78 View Post
    So its putting air till 25 C and then lift?
    For the moment, use that as a guide.

    The time it takes to steam milk on the 6910 though is a lot slower than on most machines so you might find stretching til 25C too much. The important thing is to try and maintain that whirlpool.

    -Aaron

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Try looking at it like this -

    Steam temp controls how long it takes the milk to warm, steam pump controls how powerful the swirling effect is. the whole dry/wet thing is deceiving.

    To your video your problems start right at the beginning - you have no real movement. Try this -

    As you look down at the milk divide the "circle" in to imaginary quarters. Put the wand in as far as the join between the stem and tip in the lower top left "quarter" (about the 9 o'clock line) with the jug tilted slightly away from the machine. Open the valve and get the milk spinning without any air going in. This only takes a few seconds - then lower the jug until you get the "hiss" of the air entering the milk. If you have a thermo introduce air to 25C, if by hand go until the jug loses its cold edge, then lift the jug so the tip is back where you started. Work on keeping the tip absolutely still , only moving the jug if the swirling milk is in danger of causing more air to be sucked in.

    Hope that helps some.

    C.
    Ok... sooo... Lower top left quarter would be just over the 9 oclock line right? how far away from the pitcher?

    Need to test this!

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Yep - and start mid way from the centre to the side of the pitcher but if anything err towards the side to get the swirling started. Start by heating to 25C - for more or denser foam you can go longer, for less go lower. You'll find a point that suits your technique.

  20. #20
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288
    Nothing looks way out of place to me.

    There is very little rolling of the milk even after you sink the wand. Try less milk in the jug.

    I wouldn't be putting the wand that close to the side of the jug with the jug tilted to make the milk deeper there. Try different positions and tilts and see if you can get the milk rolling--the foam just sits on top and doesn't get rolled over and incorporated into the milk.

    You might have gone a bit long in each stage--my preference would be to sink the wand 4 or 5 seconds earlier than you did and to finish when the sound just starts to deepen.

    Do try a good whole milk and see how you go. I have recommended A2 to many and it works a treat for nearly all. Yes its more expensive, but I use so little (about 30-40 ml in a doppio ristretto) that the cost is not an issue.

    Greg

  21. #21
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by GregWormald View Post
    Nothing looks way out of place to me.

    There is very little rolling of the milk even after you sink the wand. Try less milk in the jug.

    I wouldn't be putting the wand that close to the side of the jug with the jug tilted to make the milk deeper there. Try different positions and tilts and see if you can get the milk rolling--the foam just sits on top and doesn't get rolled over and incorporated into the milk.

    You might have gone a bit long in each stage--my preference would be to sink the wand 4 or 5 seconds earlier than you did and to finish when the sound just starts to deepen.

    Do try a good whole milk and see how you go. I have recommended A2 to many and it works a treat for nearly all. Yes its more expensive, but I use so little (about 30-40 ml in a doppio ristretto) that the cost is not an issue.

    Greg
    Guys, I think that my issue is "how to get air" into the milk. I always end up with a small layer of big bubbles... and after tapping the pitcher, they almost go away.

    Si, the tip of the wand has to be touching the milk or just below the milk level? This is a 1 hole tip.

  22. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    How did you go with the whirlpool??

    What the whirlpool should do is merge that layer in with the rest of the milk...here's a quick example I found on the tube:
    Steaming milk and practising Latte Art on Rancilio Silvia - YouTube

    This person's technique isn't perfect, but it's got the basics on what you should be aiming for: whirlpool (a bit hard to see in this vid, but you can just making out the spinning of it), slow stretch with no big bubbles, keeping the milk moving in the pitcher. Once you establish these basics, then you can hone in on perfecting them.

    -Aaron

  23. #23
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288
    Quote Originally Posted by cherni78 View Post
    Guys, I think that my issue is "how to get air" into the milk. I always end up with a small layer of big bubbles... and after tapping the pitcher, they almost go away.

    Si, the tip of the wand has to be touching the milk or just below the milk level? This is a 1 hole tip.

    Getting air into the milk is not a problem--imagine how much air/steam is injected into the milk in your 40 second texture attempts.
    The issue is breaking up the bubbles and heating the milk solids so the tiny bubbles get trapped and stay there.
    This is, IMO, an issue about movement within the jug, pressure, and the quality of the milk.

    Please do try some known high quality milk. There are times during the year, and some milks, that just will not texture.

    Greg

  24. #24
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronpratt View Post
    How did you go with the whirlpool??

    What the whirlpool should do is merge that layer in with the rest of the milk...here's a quick example I found on the tube:
    Steaming milk and practising Latte Art on Rancilio Silvia - YouTube

    This person's technique isn't perfect, but it's got the basics on what you should be aiming for: whirlpool (a bit hard to see in this vid, but you can just making out the spinning of it), slow stretch with no big bubbles, keeping the milk moving in the pitcher. Once you establish these basics, then you can hone in on perfecting them.

    -Aaron
    Hi Aaron! that is a great video... thanks for it. I had no chance to do make one today, but tomorrow I will!

  25. #25
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by GregWormald View Post
    Getting air into the milk is not a problem--imagine how much air/steam is injected into the milk in your 40 second texture attempts.
    The issue is breaking up the bubbles and heating the milk solids so the tiny bubbles get trapped and stay there.
    This is, IMO, an issue about movement within the jug, pressure, and the quality of the milk.

    Please do try some known high quality milk. There are times during the year, and some milks, that just will not texture.

    Greg
    Hi Greg, I think I will try with full fat milk just to see if its me or the milk I am using. Give me some days to try this.... I am using 2% fat milk... maybe that is the reason why it is soo difficult?

  26. #26
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Guys.l.. think I made it!!!

    Changed the milk... Pauls milk, the ones in the fridge at coles instead of the devondale. I also bought a thermometer...

    Got it spinning and stretched till 25C and then spinning all the way up to 60C. ended up with no big bubbles and it looked shinny and silked

    SO excited guys!!!

    One thing though! I wasn't able to make any latte art.... is this because I need more foam right?

  27. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Or more practice!

    Try stretching to 30 to see what happens but I suspect you need a bit more air going in before 25, try both ways and see what happens. With more air lower the jug until you create big bubblesn the come back a tad. Note where the tip is relevant to the milk level and chuck the milk and start again - that's your spot to aim for - its a really fine adjustment and takes a bit of practice.

  28. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    171
    With the EM6910 I stretched to 40deg and got great art
    This was generally using Zymil.

  29. #29
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Or more practice!

    Try stretching to 30 to see what happens but I suspect you need a bit more air going in before 25, try both ways and see what happens. With more air lower the jug until you create big bubblesn the come back a tad. Note where the tip is relevant to the milk level and chuck the milk and start again - that's your spot to aim for - its a really fine adjustment and takes a bit of practice.
    Hi Chris!

    Yeah, I think that 30C is too much foam. I also found out that whirlpool is best if I put the tip in the upper left quarter (i.e. 11 oclock).

    Sometimes as soon as I start pouring milk a lot of foam is placed into the coffee breaking the crema and then making a disaster for latte art. I guess that is because I have too much microfoam right? Or is it because its not uniformity distributed across the milk?

  30. #30
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by thebookfreak58 View Post
    With the EM6910 I stretched to 40deg and got great art
    This was generally using Zymil.
    Hi! What settings are you using for steam temp and pump? If I go to 40 I would end up with a lot of foam... How much microfoam is required for latte art?

  31. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    171

    3 months, still no good microfoam! Help

    Oh gosh...to be honest I can't remember the settings (moved to a different machine) but I remember it was the settings that were commonly posted here...

  32. #32
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Quote Originally Posted by cherni78 View Post
    Hi Chris!

    Yeah, I think that 30C is too much foam. I also found out that whirlpool is best if I put the tip in the upper left quarter (i.e. 11 oclock).

    Sometimes as soon as I start pouring milk a lot of foam is placed into the coffee breaking the crema and then making a disaster for latte art. I guess that is because I have too much microfoam right? Or is it because its not uniformity distributed across the milk?
    Its getting that balance of foam and combination with the milk that is the hardest part. Basically that lump of foam is overstretched milk (I do it all the time if usually for the first of the day when I'm half asleep!) so your just over doing it a touch. As an experiment after you hit 25 try going quite deep and angled with the wand and jug. You'll see the tumbling effect increase (as in less spinning as such, more tumbling) and help the mixing.

    Another technique that's a bit imprecise but has can work ok is to get the milk spinning nicely at the beginning, get air in for no more than two seconds, then drop the wand to finish the heating. This gives a lower foam for art - but can a bit hit and miss. One to play with though.

  33. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Its getting that balance of foam and combination with the milk that is the hardest part. Basically that lump of foam is overstretched milk (I do it all the time if usually for the first of the day when I'm half asleep!) so your just over doing it a touch. As an experiment after you hit 25 try going quite deep and angled with the wand and jug. You'll see the tumbling effect increase (as in less spinning as such, more tumbling) and help the mixing.

    Another technique that's a bit imprecise but has can work ok is to get the milk spinning nicely at the beginning, get air in for no more than two seconds, then drop the wand to finish the heating. This gives a lower foam for art - but can a bit hit and miss. One to play with though.
    Hi Chris!

    YEah, actually it looks like EM6910 takes longer to heat up the milk to 60C. So I guess the "stretching" phase should be shorter.

    Is it better to stretch when the milk is more colder or maybe from 25C to 40C?

  34. #34
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Stretch as soon as possible - the colder the milk the better the 'structure' change should hold.

  35. #35
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,116
    Reading back through this thread, Cherni was having trouble with separation of steamed Devondale skim milk. He can create good textured milk with full cream and with detergent water so nothing wrong with the machine or the technique.
    So would a valid conclusion be that the milk is the problem? What if you tried a different brand of skim milk?
    Does it have to be skim milk? Is there that much a difference between skim and low fat if you are only drinking one or two cups of coffee per day?

  36. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Flynnaus - lower quality milk will expose flaws in technique. Cherni was nearly there but with proper fresh milk and a few minor tweaks things are on the way up. Your right to a fair degree - the basis for a milk to stretch also involves quality fats and proteins in the milk an their interacation with heat and air - technique is only part.

    Cherni - always forget to ask - what steam settings do you use?

  37. #37
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Flynnaus - lower quality milk will expose flaws in technique. Cherni was nearly there but with proper fresh milk and a few minor tweaks things are on the way up. Your right to a fair degree - the basis for a milk to stretch also involves quality fats and proteins in the milk an their interacation with heat and air - technique is only part.

    Cherni - always forget to ask - what steam settings do you use?
    Hey Guys, I think my technique needed some improvement, which thanks to all the tips here, I have to say I am far better from where I started.

    Regarding milk, mmm yeah it makes a difference. I.e. with Pauls semi-skim I have better results than with devondale semi-skim. I don't know the difference between them, the only think I do know is that one is in the fridge and the other one isn't.

    My settings now are high temp and wettest. Regarding the wetness. in the EM6910 it means more "pump rate"... still, it is quite dry I think, but with more power.

    My pending: Get foam uniformly distributed in the milk to create latte art... that is something I haven't achieved quite yet. Maybe its because I need less foam.

  38. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    Quote Originally Posted by cherni78 View Post
    Hey Guys, I think my technique needed some improvement, which thanks to all the tips here, I have to say I am far better from where I started.

    Regarding milk, mmm yeah it makes a difference. I.e. with Pauls semi-skim I have better results than with devondale semi-skim. I don't know the difference between them, the only think I do know is that one is in the fridge and the other one isn't.

    My settings now are high temp and wettest. Regarding the wetness. in the EM6910 it means more "pump rate"... still, it is quite dry I think, but with more power.

    My pending: Get foam uniformly distributed in the milk to create latte art... that is something I haven't achieved quite yet. Maybe its because I need less foam.
    Hey Cherni,

    Glad to hear you're heading in the right direction. In terms of the whole milk brand argument, I gotta agree with Chris - that the lower quality milks will expose the flaws in technique that you need to work on. I for instance am allergic to dairy, and so only steam soy milk for myself (Coles brand on the most part), which really exposes technique flaws. The way I see it, by honing in my technique with that milk, when I do move across to dairy milk (skim or full cream) the microfoam I produce is extremely good.

    Once again, to diagnose if your frothing too much a video would certainly help but by the sounds of it, perhaps all you need is practise, practise, practise

    -Aaron

  39. #39
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronpratt View Post
    Hey Cherni,

    Glad to hear you're heading in the right direction. In terms of the whole milk brand argument, I gotta agree with Chris - that the lower quality milks will expose the flaws in technique that you need to work on. I for instance am allergic to dairy, and so only steam soy milk for myself (Coles brand on the most part), which really exposes technique flaws. The way I see it, by honing in my technique with that milk, when I do move across to dairy milk (skim or full cream) the microfoam I produce is extremely good.

    Once again, to diagnose if your frothing too much a video would certainly help but by the sounds of it, perhaps all you need is practise, practise, practise

    -Aaron

    Thanks Aaron!

    I have one more question to you guys... one I stretched the milk, how much below the surface of the milk shall I put the tip in? I read that it should be in a position where it makes no noise (i.e. in the microfoam area). If I do that, the foam gets stretched... again.

    So, my fear is, if I put the tip to low into the milk, it won't mix the microfoam....

    Suggestions?

  40. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    143
    Go to a point below the surface and where you get the best mixing. As long as your not drawing air into the milk your on the right track. Remember as you heat the milk the air expands so you will see an increase in volume even though no air is being added.

  41. #41
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Go to a point below the surface and where you get the best mixing. As long as your not drawing air into the milk your on the right track. Remember as you heat the milk the air expands so you will see an increase in volume even though no air is being added.
    Hi Chris!

    I will try putting it lower... I added air for a couple of secs (i.e. from 10C to 20C) and then lowerd it where the stem starts. might need a little lower. Will give it a try!

    Cheers!

  42. #42
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,288
    My steam tip never gets lower than about half-way to the start of the stem. Mind you, I do stretch very small quantities of milk, but I doubt I've ever buried the tip.

    Greg

  43. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Toowoomba QLD
    Posts
    417
    I agree with Greg. When I was using the 6910 I found that submerging the steam tip very far (certainly never the whole tip) gave lousy results. I don't think it has the power to roll the milk properly and you're better of just trying to keep the foam on the top moving by holding the tip just under the surface near the side of the jug while everything heats. Then a good 10-15 seconds swirling before you poor usually gives good results.

    Pete

  44. #44
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    76
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete39 View Post
    I agree with Greg. When I was using the 6910 I found that submerging the steam tip very far (certainly never the whole tip) gave lousy results. I don't think it has the power to roll the milk properly and you're better of just trying to keep the foam on the top moving by holding the tip just under the surface near the side of the jug while everything heats. Then a good 10-15 seconds swirling before you poor usually gives good results.

    Pete
    Hi Pete,

    Today I found that the less air that I introduce to the milk will yield better results to the foam and latte art... Still adjusting!

  45. #45
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Toowoomba QLD
    Posts
    417
    Sounds like you're moving in the right direction. Its very satisfying when things finally start to fall into place hey? Hope things keep getting better!

    Pete

  46. #46
    Rbn
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Southland NZ
    Posts
    452
    Good reading -I have had my "used" EM6910 for 18 months now.
    Recently spent 2 weeks away from my machine!

    Had to kind of relearn a little!
    Found I could adjust things a little so made the steam the hottest and wettest.
    Seems to make quite a difference.
    More practice coming up.

  47. #47
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    22
    had a look at your video - you're introducing too much air early in the piece (therefore high squealing noise from start to 39sec = hot non-stretched milk) you want that nice quiet noise from 39sec onwards throughout the whole procedure which will give you a nice silky texture. a good way to practice is with water (it is as much as a visual thing as it is a hearing thing i.e. watch the milk being stretched and hear for that nice quiet noise)

  48. #48
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    142
    i had a huge revelation today steaming small quantities of milk on my anita 2 hole steam wand...

    again, take what i say with a pinch of sale as it boils down to personal technique and applies to steam tips with more than 1 hole, but...

    there is NO standard jug position for each machine, this differs upon, wait for it, how your steam tip is screwed onto your steam wand, i.e. how the holes are orientated. They are not always in a 3/9 'o clock position mine was 2/8 'o clock as such I shift my wand to the right wall of my jug when steaming and the result is a clockwise whirlpool as opposed to a huge wave current against the back wall of my jug which is the 'standard' method used by many...

  49. #49
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    9
    start swirl the milk a bit early before the temp got too high.... try that



Similar Threads

  1. EM5900 owners unite in the name of good microfoam!
    By iggs in forum Milk Froth and Bubbles
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: 2nd July 2014, 10:06 PM
  2. Cant get good microfoam with Sunbeam EM5900
    By byronator in forum Milk Froth and Bubbles
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 15th April 2011, 03:58 PM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 9th June 2010, 11:00 PM
  4. YES I HAVE MICROFOAM!!!
    By greenman in forum Milk Froth and Bubbles
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 27th September 2007, 04:31 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •