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Thread: cant make latte art

  1. #1
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    cant make latte art

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    my steamer is one hole nozzle =.=
    too much foam, please teach me how to froth?

    this is the video after i scoop away the foam...

  2. #2
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    Stretching the milk ia fine but you need to swirl the milk to remove all the big bubbles so I would suggest doing it at an angle. But by looking at your video it seems like like the steam wand is fix? You never see a barista froth the milk directly downward which will create big bubbles it's always done at an angle and they will swirl the milk while stretching it.

    Good luck. all it takes is practice. Buy cheap milk of 3ltrs and just practice in small portion.

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    A cheap way of practicing is using water and a drop of dishwashing liquid to substitute the milk

  4. #4
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    There's a lot of advice and some good video in the 'Milk Froth and Bubbles' section, have a good read there.

    What machine are you using?

    There seems to be plenty of movement in the milk on the left side of the jug, so steam power should be ok,
    it's a bit slow but the thick protein you show after intermission suggests overheated milk.

    It also appears to be split, also a sign of overheating.

    It is quite possible to steam milk with a vertical wand but you could try getting an angle.
    Anything from 10°-45° off vertical. Check video already posted in other threads.

    All the noises (screaming) suggest that the steam tip is too deep into the milk, especially at the start.
    Hard to tell from the point of view and the big chunk of blank screen.

    In the second video there doesn't appear to be any crema left on the shot of coffee; as a general rule; no crema = no art.
    Pour art is achieved more by correct milk texturing than by the actual pour technique. There are squillions of videos on
    youtube and vimeo about pouring technique but it won't happen if the milk is too thin or too thick.

    Creamy paint is a good analogy for good milk texture.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    There's a lot of advice and some good video in the 'Milk Froth and Bubbles' section, have a good read there.

    What machine are you using?

    There seems to be plenty of movement in the milk on the left side of the jug, so steam power should be ok,
    it's a bit slow but the thick protein you show after intermission suggests overheated milk.

    It also appears to be split, also a sign of overheating.

    It is quite possible to steam milk with a vertical wand but you could try getting an angle.
    Anything from 10°-45° off vertical. Check video already posted in other threads.

    All the noises (screaming) suggest that the steam tip is too deep into the milk, especially at the start.
    Hard to tell from the point of view and the big chunk of blank screen.

    In the second video there doesn't appear to be any crema left on the shot of coffee; as a general rule; no crema = no art.
    Pour art is achieved more by correct milk texturing than by the actual pour technique. There are squillions of videos on
    youtube and vimeo about pouring technique but it won't happen if the milk is too thin or too thick.

    Creamy paint is a good analogy for good milk texture.
    i'm using ESAM6900

  6. #6
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Thought it looked something like that.
    These machines are designed to froth milk, not stretch and texture.

    You'll be pushing it all uphill to get good pour art quality milk.

    good luck ;-D

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    what should i do?

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    Should you wish to stay with your current machine, you can always try to do etching latte art which is similar to cake decorating using chocolate sauce, it can make some impressive visual impacts. For free pour latte art, you most likely will need a different coffee machine that allows manual method of steaming milk.

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    i am gonna stay with this machine
    i did create whrilpool but it still has a lot of foam and bubbles
    can someone please help?

  10. #10
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    Time to become religious, if not already, omouth99. While you'll be able to improve your technique, if you expect to be able to properly stretch milk with the Delonghi, you'll probably end up a tad disappointed. Maybe lower your sights if you are going to stick with the machine?
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  11. #11
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    y cant my machine works on latte?
    i really want to make latte art with this machine
    any guide that could help with?

  12. #12
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    I'd like to win the Melbourne Cup, but I'm not a horse.
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  13. #13
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    omouth99, it's a little difficult to formulate a reply to your question and address your plea for help without being blunt.

    Your question has been answered; the ability of your machine is limited.

    Have you tried any of the tips proffered? Remember........ if your milk is screaming, it's screaming for air, bring the steam
    nozzle closer to the milk surface and allow it suck in some air.

    I am in agreement with Barry O'; if you wish to keep this machine, you will have to compromise your expectations.
    You may get part of the way but methinks, with a machine like this........... not all the way.
    Last edited by chokkidog; 18th December 2013 at 08:03 PM. Reason: punctuation

  14. #14
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    can you teach me the concept of milk stretching and texturing?

  15. #15
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    Have you actually followed the advice in posts above and had a look in the 'milk froth and bubbles' sub-forum? Ultimately, with the kindest of intent.....it doesn't appear that you are willing to listen to answers that you don't like.

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    i did look in the milk froth and bubbles section but none of them works for me

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    20131218_181648.jpg
    i will keep practicing until i have a perfect heart
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    About the only thing that might help is if you can get something like silicon tubing to fit tightly over your milk nozzle to extend the steam out to where you can make use of it. Your milk system doesn't allow you to work properly. Full stop. No if's, no but's, no maybe's. If you want to make milk like a pro you need to be able to place the steam where you want it, move the jug to where it needs to be.

    So 2 things - see if you can find a way to make a hose out of the steam device and go and do a Barista course to learn how milk is stretched and textured - the experience is almost a necessity - it is hard to explain in words but watching it done, then trying it yourself and getting advice on technique cannot be beaten.

    If you can't get your steam to where you need it, time to bite the bullet, sell the machine and use the money to get a proper machine. You can hammer a nail with a saw but it's a lot of work you could avoid if you get a hammer.
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  19. #19
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    Latte art for me is just window dressing.

    You could draw me the Taj Mahal encircled by juggling poodles and I still I couldn't really give a toss! Whilst it might look pretty, it can often be used solely to cover up all sorts lousy espresso. TBH, if the milk is well textured that's great.

    My advice, forget about it. You will gain more by tweaking your machine to get the best possible coffee out of it (and that's a big ask in this market segment) rather than look for added bling.
    Journeyman and TampIt like this.

  20. #20
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    i will listen to your advice if i am the owner of the machine so i have to stick with it
    it's a challenge my friend gave to me
    have to find how to make a perfect latte with this machine ==
    i saw someone also made a video and could froth milk for latte art
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNUv2UDZICM

  21. #21
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    Best sell the machine and buy a real one then.

  22. #22
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Then the video is all you need............ Have you followed the advice it contains, along with the tips
    people have provided, since your first post?

    If you are after perfect......... buy a real machine, as Chris plainly says, do a latté art course as Journeyman suggests.
    There are courses where you can take your own machine along...........even the Delonghi.
    The pour art in the video link you provided is less than perfect and not much better than your attempt in post #17.

    Other than that .......... perfection in latté art can't be bought or borrowed but has to be earned.
    Be humble. Practice. Find your own Zen.
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  23. #23
    Senior Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    When I did my barista course, the morning was how to make coffee and the after noon was how to do Latté art. I listened in the arvo to what was said, admired the video and then went back to trying to push as many coffees through in as little time as I could. With the instructor's permission - I explained what I was interested in was the skills to work as a professional barista - when I had the skills to handle the workload of a busy café, then I would spend time learning pretty.

    I think people would rather have a nicely crafted coffee than a picture, no matter how impressive, on a poorly made one.

    Those ESAM machines are not cheap, so chances are you'd get a good price for it, enough to buy a good grinder and machine that will let you perfect your skills and get your art up to your expected level.

    I wish you luck on your journey - but I think you're handicapping yourself trying to use what you have.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by omouth99 View Post
    i will listen to your advice if i am the owner of the machine so i have to stick with it
    it's a challenge my friend gave to me
    have to find how to make a perfect latte with this machine ==
    i saw someone also made a video and could froth milk for latte art
    Delonghi ECAM 22.110.sb Latte art basic course
    Hi omouth99

    Firstly, the previous posters are correct, I would get rid of it and spend most of the $$$'s on a decent grinder and the leftover on a "real espresso machine". Even $400 for both would be achievable, and the DL should be "worth" more than that secondhand.

    IF I had to do this for a bet it would have to be a $1,000+ one. The following is the brief version of what I would do.

    1) Descale the machine and / or replace the pump. Yours is taking at least twice as long as the "DL video" to heat the milk. A Breville Cafe Roma (the $150 one) would be three times quicker on a bad day. BTW, I won a fair sized bet with one of those by making "espresso plus latte art" via an aftermarket single floor basket and "bashing a lip" on the Breville jug to make it pour. No other mods needed for it, unless you count a really good grinder.

    2) Get a milk jug with a lip at the end of the spout (notice theirs has, yours hasn't - how strange?). No lip, no decent poor. I would probably also get the 350ml Espro Toroidal jug to see if it helps with that machine (it is still on my "buy another to play with list" as my first one went AWOL before I used it). Gives me two options.

    3) Get a milk thermometer. "Too hot" = 50 degrees. Latte: somewhere between 50 and 72/73 degrees depending upon the milk. After 40 years doing this, I still carry a spare milk thermo to all important sessions. You can actually "do the art" a fair way below or above scalded, however to pick up the extra sweetness & texture as a combo, most mere mortals need a thermo. My last one cost of $15 at a home / kitchen type shop. Be aware, they all have a lag in reading the temp and you have to allow for it. The "combo" is usually about a degree before scalding, and is a very tight temperature range.

    4) I do not know how far you can move the spout out at an angle, but I would maximise it. FWIW, I have been known to half fill a machine with water and put a block of wood under one side to help this for a bet (not the Breville one, it is fine "as is").

    5) Play with different milks: they all react differently, and you need one that copes with "half a day of heating". Most don't.

    6) The good news, unlike most newer machines, you have no way to blow the milk apart and scald it before it reaches room temp. The bad news: a lot of the posts in Milk Froth and Bubbles will not be much use as they are aimed at the newer (i.e. uber powerful steaming) machines.

    After all that, you can nail it with practice. Or buy something that works out of the box...

    Hope this gives you a few ideas.

    TampIt
    Last edited by TampIt; 19th December 2013 at 12:59 PM. Reason: Typo

  25. #25
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    i have my own machine
    but i want to beat my friend's challenge

  26. #26
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    my friend?
    ........... I'll be back, it's in the mail and ...... it wasn't me! Oh, and we must catch up............I'll call you!....... ;-D

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    its the timing

  28. #28
    Senior Member sidewayss's Avatar
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    Smile

    I have an idea omouth99.
    If the "challenge" includes etching, extract the espresso and then pour the milk in a stream from a height til full. Place spots of froth either randomly or in a pattern, get a toothpick or skewer and draw it through each spot in a straight or wavy line.
    Another one is to place froth in a crossed fashion, then use the skewer to draw swirls to get a cyclonic design.
    To us snobs, free pouring is true latte art, and etching is frowned upon. However, this is the best advice I can give you given the limitations you are undertaking upon yourself.

    If you can pull off a decent rosetta or a 4 leaf tulip on that machine you got there, you can do great latte art on any semi auto or manual machine.

    Good luck. Do stick around and learn a few more things on this and other forums as well as stick around specialty cafes in your area.

    If you can, do a certified barista course. This will open up a lot of knowledge for you.
    As mentioned before, a cheap semi auto like the Breville or Sunbeam will produce better results and they are affordable if you do decide to upgrade.
    You will never regret it.



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