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Thread: Group handle question

  1. #1
    Senior Member Lovey's Avatar
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    Group handle question

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Why is it that when you type "porta filter" into CS, it changes to group handle?

  2. #2
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    Re: Group handle question

    its auto corrected in the forum, Andys way of unamericanising us ;D

  3. #3
    Senior Member Lovey's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    I realise that it was auto corrected, but why the need for it?

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    Re: Group handle question

    There is no need, just one of the little quirks of this site. ;)

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    Re: Group handle question

    Lovey just a case of "we" know best ;)

  6. #6
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 616F626D7A6C6D030 link=1260754559/4#4 date=1260773679
    Lovey just a case of "we" know best ;)
    Not for me to judge, Im just a recent blow in. ::)

  7. #7
    Senior Member Lovey's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 202E232C3B2D2C420 link=1260754559/4#4 date=1260773679
    Lovey just a case of "we" know best Wink
    Whos we :-?.
    In relation to un-americanising of the site (if that is the purpose of the auto-edit) Im all for it.
    I think we should have our own identity as Ozzies, but I think that there could be a bit more consistency across the site.
    The last time I checked, we used the metric system, but hardly a day goes by when people on this site (Australians) use fl oz measurements to describe the size of their drinks and it peeves me somewhat.
    End of rant, Ill get back into my air-conditioned box now 8-).

  8. #8
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 1231283B275E0 link=1260754559/6#6 date=1261015423
    Quote Originally Posted by 202E232C3B2D2C420 link=1260754559/4#4 date=1260773679
    Lovey just a case of "we" know best Wink
    Whos we *:-?.
    In relation to un-americanising of the site (if that is the purpose of the auto-edit) Im all for it.
    I think we should have our own identity as Ozzies, but I think that there could be a bit more consistency across the site.
    The last time I checked, we used the metric system, but hardly a day goes by when people on this site (Australians) use fl oz measurements to describe the size of their drinks and it peeves me somewhat.
    End of rant, Ill get back into my air-conditioned box now 8-). *
    Good.. Now stay there... Caus it is hot outside.. *;D

    Many of us are older and thus have been schooled in both systems... And we get the US marketing still.

    The issue is that even in the metric system there are different Si Units for different countries... It is a pain in the backside for all.. Medical an is one area where the differences can threaten lives and lets not forget some of the big issues with defence contracts etc; In teh USA and even Australia, where contractors and other countries all try to work on the same project and get it wrong... Some time with catastrophic results.

    So while I prefer metric in many cases I often swap my mind set with out thinking.. *;D :D ;) *

    Good thing I dont do the same when with the wife *;D :D :o

    PS. *My pet peeve is that 99% of IT people DO NOT know how to set up a PC and KB to ensure that office and other apps use Australian by default...

    Setting the default language is not the WAY... * The language is defined by the region AND KEYBOARD!!! *Yet keyboard.. * And it is the correct way. *If ya want US select US keyboard with Australian and you will get US spelling etc.. *When you set a system up.. Select Australian for the region etc and set the KB to US International and you will get Australian spelling etc.. Because it looks at the KB first and then ya region.

    If ya in another country.. Tis not such a problem as they have a defined KB layout... While most of us use a US 101... Thus the system says Australian region.... BUT the user is using a US KB = US spelling.

    For gawd sake... You IT people get it ringt... And make sure you images and corporate systems are set up correctly... *Same when loading Acrobat and may other systems.. Looks at KB and defined page size as letter Doh... *>:( *>:( * >:( * >:( *:-? *

    I have macros written to auto correct ALL office aps that hit my desk in US format.. And that is about 95% of them..

    ALSO.. Please save ya ppt as pps.. *PPS = Show * *PPT = Template (used to edit not present in front of people..) *And if ya can work out how to do it.. (Use teh drop down in the save option). *Just *change the t or s on the end as you need it. *Is S = presentation *T = I want to edit / make changes.

    Powerpoint recognises the extension and does what you ask of it... *Nothing worse than watching a "Pro"do a presentation and spent time trying to get it to run as a show... And by then you have seen half his slides and have already started to non off...

    :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

    PS. I am an old schooled MCP so actually know what I am on about with this crap... Not like coffee... Still a beginner ;D

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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 19363F3D2A153936393F3D353D362C580 link=1260754559/7#7 date=1261016067
    The issue is that even in the metric system there are different Si Units for different countries... It is a pain in the backside for all.. *
    You must be misinformed. SI units and SI derived units DO NOT change.

    Example:

    Length: metres
    Time: seconds
    Pressure: Pascals (kg/ms/ms)
    Force: Newtons (kg/s/s)
    Energy: Joules
    Temperature: Kelvin

    the only difference is when you start using prefixes for larger quantities for example: kPa (kiloPascal), MJ (megaJoules) etc.

    SI units will always be SI units everywhere in the world, whether youre in Mongolia designing the next coal mining crushing facility or in the Australia working with Defence Materiel Organisation.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Yelta's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Aint it amazing how threads evolve/degenerate, started as a question about port*filter v group handle and now were talkin about the metric system.

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    Re: Group handle question

    @Lovey/AM: Couldnt agree with you more! How rare it is to hear schedule pronounced correctly nowadays. Kids ordering fries (chips!) with ketchup (tomato sauce!)....were losing our national identity!

    @Wushoes: Quite right. SI units are constant but their application sadly, is not.

    ICAO (Global governing aviation body) recommended the world go metric. China complied (altitudes in metres, wind speeds in metres per second etc) and what happened? US said "you cant tell us what to do, were American". They stayed fully imperial, most countries are hybrid and China...after doing what it was told....now has an orphan system where airliners are cleared to altitudes in metres but set altitudes in feet that come from a dodgy little conversion card carried in the cockpit.

  12. #12
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    To say nothing of the fact that US ounces are not the same size as Imperial ounces, and (as far as I know) Australia is the only country that calls 20 ml a Tablespoon--the rest of the world uses 15 ml Tablespoons.

    And of course people use ml and cc as if they are the same, and............

    Greg

  13. #13
    Senior Member Dennis's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 17223B316564520 link=1260754559/10#10 date=1261020425
    They stayed fully imperial, most countries are hybrid and China...after doing what it was told....now has an orphan system where airliners are cleared to altitudes in metres but set altitudes in feet that come from a dodgy little conversion card carried in the cockpit.
    Eek - I think Andy has flown Air China!

    Dont we still have plenty of 600ml drink containers which really, are just a close conversion of a pint?

    I think I prefer my Mums measurement method, particularly relating to recipes and questions I aske of her at her "master chefs classes"....

    Me: How much butter goes into that Mum?
    Mum: Two fingers

    Me: Should I add more milk?
    Mum: Yes.....(then)...thats too much

    Me: How much flour should I add?
    Mum: 1/2 a cup
    Consequent call to Mum: I added 1/2 a cup but it doesnt seem right
    Mum: Which cup did you use?






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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 53667173437B6679757870140 link=1260754559/11#11 date=1261044937
    And of course people use ml and cc as if they are the same
    Umm... but 1 cc (cubic centimeter) = 1 mL

    whats more 1 cc of pure water at 3.98 C (I think) roughly equals 1 gram.

  15. #15
    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 55747F7F7862110 link=1260754559/12#12 date=1261045918
    Mum: Which cup did you use?
    ;D



    In 1875, the United States solidified its commitment to the development of the internationally recognized metric system by becoming one of the original seventeen signatory nations to the Metre Convention or the Treaty of the Meter. The signing of this international agreement concluded five years of meetings in which the metric system was reformulated, refining the accuracy of its standards. The Treaty of the Meter established the Bureau international des poids et mesures (BIPM, International Bureau of Weights and Measures) in Svres, France, to provide standards of measurement for worldwide use.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrica..._United_States

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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 76575C5C5B41320 link=1260754559/12#12 date=1261045918
    Dont we still have plenty of 600ml drink containers which really, are just a close conversion of a pint?

    A pint is 585mls if memory serves me correctly.


  17. #17
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 6B4A4141465C2F0 link=1260754559/12#12 date=1261045918
    Eek - I think Andy has flown Air China!
    Yes I did, to the World Latte Art champs in Germany (via Shanghai). *An "interesting" trip and not a word of English in either direction so I cannot confirm if the pilots used feet or meters
    :)

    Quote Originally Posted by 6340594A562F0 link=1260754559/0#0 date=1260754559
    Why is it that when you type "porta filter" into CS, it changes to group handle? *
    This was answered by others in the thread before it went way off the rails. *

    PS: I was going to "auto change" it to portapotty

    8-)

    Quote Originally Posted by 787C5A434346594E412F0 link=1260754559/1#1 date=1260754812
    unamericanising
    I think that should be unamericaniZing Sully.... or maybe unamericanising is already unamericanized
    ;D

    Quote Originally Posted by 6340594A562F0 link=1260754559/6#6 date=1261015423
    The last time I checked, we used the metric system, but hardly a day goes by when people on this site (Australians) use fl oz measurements to describe the size of their drinks and it peeves me somewhat.
    Me too, Im a metric baby and (just) and have to convert. *It would be harder to change those on the site.

    The funny thing is that even some of the Italian machine manufacturers are now using "porta filter" in their "English" manuals. *I can only guess they get more pressure from America than the rest of the English speaking countries.

    Sigh, its a battle... mostly uphill from our little island on the wrong side of the planet.

  18. #18
    A_M
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 1331372C2B2137440 link=1260754559/8#8 date=1261018243
    Quote Originally Posted by 19363F3D2A153936393F3D353D362C580 link=1260754559/7#7 date=1261016067
    The issue is that even in the metric system there are different Si Units for different countries... It is a pain in the backside for all.. *
    You must be misinformed. SI units and SI derived units DO NOT change.

    Example:

    Length: metres
    Time: seconds
    Pressure: Pascals (kg/ms/ms)
    Force: Newtons (kg/s/s)
    Energy: Joules
    Temperature: Kelvin

    the only difference is when you start using prefixes for larger quantities for example: kPa (kiloPascal), MJ (megaJoules) etc.

    SI units will always be SI units everywhere in the world, whether youre in Mongolia designing the next coal mining crushing facility or in the Australia working with Defence Materiel Organisation.
    Sorry... They do... Change.. Well in fact people use a twist on SI units as to the prefix....... Just like metric... Where in threads Japan and others use a different pitch to others.. Thus a 3mm screw is not a 3mm screw.. It will depend on teh pitch of the thread.

    In the medical field it can be a pain as some values can change by a factor of 10 (not just large values...) while others do not... See here http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/units/scales/clinical_data.html

    Thus confusion over SI Vs Convention and the Convention is different in different countries. Thus in a range of tests.. Some may change and some may not...

    Thus Drs can read a report put out by two different labs using teh same equipment but get what appears to be different readings.. Hgb of 112 or 11.2 Sounds simple... But trust me, in an emergency many miss read.. There are ongoing moves to have this all changed but at present it is NOT... SI = SI only when the prefixes are defined and the same...

    Oh and if you gave me a length in Meters; in a tender, you would be struck off.. The actual official measurement is mm ie. 1200 mm x 900 mm x 800 mm. NOT. 1.2M x 0.9M x 0.8M

    eg...

    There are 20 SI prefixes used to form decimal multiples and submultiples of SI units.


    It is important to note that the kilogram is the only SI unit with a prefix as part of its name and symbol. With this exception, any SI prefix may be used with any SI unit, including the degree Celsius and its symbol C.

    Example 1: 10-6 kg = 1 mg (one milligram), but not 10-6 kg = 1 kg (one microkilogram)
    Example 2: Consider the example of the height of the a Monument. We may write hW = 169 000 mm = 16 900 cm = 169 m = 0.169 km using the millimeter (SI prefix milli, symbol mm), centimeter (SI prefix centi, symbol cm), or kilometer (SI prefix kilo, symbol k).

    Because the SI prefixes strictly represent powers of 10, they should not be used to represent powers of 2. Thus, one kilobit, or 1 kbit, is 1000 bit and not 210 bit = 1024 bit. To alleviate this ambiguity, prefixes for binary multiples have been adopted by the International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC) for use in information technology.

    Lots to be read on some of the issues and changes...

    Measurement legislation
    (Last published: 28 Sep 2009)
    Legal metrology comprises all measurements carried out for any legal purpose and includes measurements that are subject to regulation by law or government decree. It has its historical origins in the need to ensure fair trade, but also includes measurements in areas such as health and safety (eg sound level meters and radiation dosimeters) and traffic control (eg vehicle speed and breath analysers).

    The Commonwealth has a constitutional head of power for weights and measures. This is set out in section 51 (xv) of the Constitution. The Commonwealth also assumes a broader leadership and coordinating role to ensure that our national measurement standards across the physical, chemical and biological spectrums conform to international standards.
    The National Measurement Act, its Regulations and Guidelines, together with state and territory legislation, provide a legal framework for the measurement system. However this is set to change.

    Such is the life of a bureaucrat :o 8-)

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    Re: Group handle question

    And guess AM would get angry, like me, when someone says ki-lom-i-ter instead of the kil-uh-mee[ch8209]ter.
    >:(

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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 032C2527300F232C2325272F272C36420 link=1260754559/17#17 date=1261497149
    Sorry... They do... Change.. Well in fact people use a twist on SI units as to the prefix....... *
    AM my learned friend, I fear you may be mistaken on this one. *

    SI Base Units (m, kg, s, A, K, mol & cd) are used to form SI derived units and are modified in magnitude by way of SI prefixes. *Companies, countries and god knows who else selectively apply the units of their choice, but the base units themselves dont change. *

    Youll buy oil by the quart/gallon in the US, litre in Australia and follow its spot price by the barrel! *Which one is correct? *None! *The SI unit for volume is the cubic metre.

    Now on to far more important things: such as coffee and the fact that Andy flew Air China and lived! * :P

    Epic76

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    A_M
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 685D444E1A1B2D0 link=1260754559/19#19 date=1261524600
    Quote Originally Posted by 032C2527300F232C2325272F272C36420 link=1260754559/17#17 date=1261497149
    Sorry... They do... Change.. Well in fact people use a twist on SI units as to the prefix....... *
    AM my learned friend, I fear you may be mistaken on this one. *

    SI Base Units (m, kg, s, A, K, mol & cd) are used to form SI derived units and are modified in magnitude by way of SI prefixes. *Companies, countries and god knows who else selectively apply the units of their choice, but the base units themselves dont change. *

    Youll buy oil by the quart/gallon in the US, litre in Australia and follow its spot price by the barrel! *Which one is correct? *None! *The SI unit for volume is the cubic metre.

    Now on to far more important things: such as coffee and the fact that Andy flew Air China and lived! * :P

    Epic76
    As highlighted ... True (the issue here is that prefixes are not always clear) and True... I guess that is the difference between those that work with measurements Vs Just use them...

    Once again Generalisation and the intent Vs the devil in the detail, has us on the same page but looking in different direction... Does that make sense :D ;D

    Tis good that these posts happen as I am sure that while many may look on and say.. Who cares, others will say... Arrr so thats what happened ;)


    PS Merry X-mas stay safe and dont try to out do Andy...

    I flew with them once or twice about 15 Years, but while surviving the flight was one thing... We had to have mules with us to carry in out service tools and test gear.. Yep... Contracted by teh Gov, but had to bring in contraband to do the work.. Very dodgy and highly stressful.. Getting in and out...

    Andy had it easy ;D

  22. #22
    A_M
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 3536242420362E570 link=1260754559/18#18 date=1261523051
    And guess AM would get angry, like me, when someone says ki-lom-i-ter instead of the kil-uh-mee[ch8209]ter.
    >:(
    Sorry... Never Angry ...

    Frustrated / Tired / Feeling un loved / Unable to comprehend / i-Brick and fat fingers / constipated followed by Incontinence / Overworked / Under worked / etc etc But Never Never ANGRY...

    Angry is a emotion I got rid of many years ago... My wife would also say that Love is also in that mix and maybe, I got rid of some of that too :o :-X

    Now How do you say Bianca ??? The correct way or the Australian way ;D

    Actually there are a few coffee terms that when say incorrectly can lead you to sit back a bit..

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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 1C333A382F103C333C3A38303833295D0 link=1260754559/20#20 date=1261526386
    I flew with them once or twice about 15 Years, but while surviving the flight was one thing... *We had to have mules with us to carry in out service tools and test gear
    Was that when you had little bags of...umm..."tomato sauce" :P

    Never a need for lying when you can be economical with the truth ;)

    Merry Christmas to you too mate!

    Ho, Ho, *Hic*

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    A_M
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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 494D6B727277687F701E0 link=1260754559/1#1 date=1260754812
    its auto corrected in the forum, Andys way of unamericanising us ;D
    AND

    Quote Originally Posted by 7C797E78647770160 link=1264204573/15#15 date=1264231324
    Quote Originally Posted by 4B6C7A6870030 link=1264204573/10#10 date=1264216580
    Hey Andy, you could really mess with AMs head, you know - you know how you have the system set up to automatically change Port*a*Filter to grouphead, if you do one of those auto correct things so that it automatically changes teh to the and it would make his posts almost unrecognisable!

    That would be hilarious ;D ;D ;D
    YA and it would mess me up big time..

    I mean - I just say basket now and that reminds me of my mum... As she would say Basket; instead of that other well know term of endearment..

    The drovers and shearers would all crack up when the old truck would not start and the crank would slip out... Us three would be in the back with teh dirty plates and mugs... And you would hear the "You Basket" come from teh front of teh truck.. The shearers would chuckle and we NEW what she really meant.. Then one of the blokes would step down and say - You right misses ?

    And he would cop it.... Basket this and basket that.... I think she even had an English accent back then...

    Then she would get it started and away we would go, back to teh station..

    Almost every lunch time would be teh same... I think every one enjoyed it and it helped to lighten the load for all.. Dammed hot / dry and dusty way out back and not too many people to converse with..

    Opps Off topic again... But strange, how little things can trigger memories.


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    Re: Group handle question

    Quote Originally Posted by 7571574E4E4B54434C220 link=1260754559/1#1 date=1260754812
    its auto corrected in the forum, Andys way of unamericanising us ;D
    Im all for avoiding Americanisms, (pet peeves are "math" v Maths, and "ass" v Arse) but Im wondering what is the background to the idea that the term "porta-filter" is American?

    Happy to be corrected but I was of the understanding that it comes from the Italian "Portafiltro".

    Look at a Bezzera Parts Manual in Italian:

    http://bezzera.it/pdf/38-it-GALATEA_DOMUS_9942031.01_ITA_ed07.08_rev00.pdf

    The term Portafiltro Completo is used here to refer to the entire Porta-Filter assembly, whilst the handle is the Manopola Portafiltro.

    Interesting discussion point regardless.

    Edit: La Marzocco also use the term Portafiltri (plural) in their Italian documentation.

    http://www.lamarzocco.it/upload/4/68/1256137603_FB80.pdf

  26. #26
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    Yet, if you look at a genuine Bezzera English manual, they describe it as a "Filter Holder".... :-?

    Nothing is ever as it seems.... :P

    Mal.

  27. #27
    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
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    Re: Group handle question

    port

    [French porter, to carry, from Old French, from Latin portre; see per-2 in Indo-European roots. N., Middle English porte, from Old French port, from porter, to carry.]

    The root word "port" means to carry or hold.
    Therefore pf = filter holder as Mal has just pointed out.

    Whether the word has evolved into Italian or English is by the by.
    The meaning comes from its origins.



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