US $1,300 before tax has been mentioned. Both this and Aus $1,500 including tax, are before any discounts.Originally Posted by 797E6F6F7E697A6F7374767E1B0 link=1301294820/722#722 date=1305923400
would be interesting to know the USA price, I know the expobar minore III with rotary pump (expobar brewtus r in the usa) sells for $1600 US. The normal minore iii dual boiler with vib pump and tank is $1500 US, So how much will the breville cost in the usa to compete, Id hate to pay $1500 AU and the USA price is $1000, forget gst, thats 10%. This would be tricky for breviile, how not to make Australian customers feel gouged, but be cheap enough in the USA to compete. Hope there will be no consumer backlash as to why it is so much cheaper in the usa than Australia for an Australian designed product from an Australian company, and it aint taxes or freight, hmmm 110V is cheaper to make ? Great machine for the money ..... in the isolation of the Australian market and what other machines cost in Australia in comparison.Originally Posted by 43607373785E45746F62606F010 link=1301294820/719#719 date=1305887610
US $1,300 before tax has been mentioned. Both this and Aus $1,500 including tax, are before any discounts.Originally Posted by 797E6F6F7E697A6F7374767E1B0 link=1301294820/722#722 date=1305923400
hope there will be some price parity between the usa and Australia on the new 900, ? I hate seeing the grinder for $139.50 US (discounted) and the best with discount in Australia is $249.Originally Posted by 6E4D5E5E55736859424F4D422C0 link=1301294820/723#723 date=1305925207
I got mine for $217.Originally Posted by 26213030213625302C2B2921440 link=1301294820/724#724 date=1305925908
Id like to buy one in Balinese Rupiah- stuff is cheap over there. Also, why cant I have a Porsche for $70k US? >:( ::)Originally Posted by 2335303021232F26262525400 link=1301294820/726#726 date=1305928418
The sting will likely happen when you see US retailers selling them for $999, their actual sale prices hurt more than RRP, always have, pure volume of sales for the win, Australia cant touch that.
Does everyone have to be so negative about everything?
We live in Australia, deal with it! Import one if you dont like the $200 difference.
What the US retailers actually sell them for Breville has no control over, the same as here in Australia, they set the RRP and if a business doesnt want to make as big a margin as they can its up to them.
Youre too kind. I generally suggest to those who point out better prices overseas that they will save even more, and be much happier, if they migrate to these lands of plenty.Originally Posted by 243F362732243F3E31233225570 link=1301294820/729#729 date=1305955048
The grass is allways greener on the other side of the fence. When the yanks in some states and counties pay their sales taxes there wont be $200 difference for the Dual Boiler.
I think that the average Ausie is better off than just about anyone anywhere else. Who can beat our employment, wages, health, economy, houses, climate, beaches, food, coffee, wine, beer. If you dont like it here you have the choice to move.
Load your coffee equipment onto a boat and become a boat person to the other side.
Just wait about a month for the Brev DB to be on the shop shelves and we will then see how it goes.
it is exactly this kind of attitude which has allowed the duopoly of Woolworths and Coles to spread its tentacles into every part of the Australian marketplace.* Shell be right, dont worry about it, deal with it.Originally Posted by 79626B7A6F7962636C7E6F780A0 link=1301294820/729#729 date=1305955048
China buying up all our mines and prime dairy producing farms?* No worries.* It is exactly this laid back attitude of most Australians which permits companies to make usury profits while we sit back and wonder why we are so highly taxed, pay so much for our houses and generally have so little discretionary spending available to our coffee habits.
Breville, or its American agent, set a wholesale price for the products.* I genuinely hope that Breville knocks this one out of the ball park in the US and has a huge hit.* I think they deserve to, with the three and a half years of research and brilliant engineering that went into the BES900 or BES900XL for our big American cousins.* It would be nice to see a company which is somewhat pigeon holed here to carve out a new and profitable niche in the US market.
I agree that it is tough to be small Australian retailer these days.* As a customer though, it is not unreasonable to see cars for less than half the price in the UK or the like and think, hang on a minute, are we being screwed?* And to cuppacoffees credit, it is almost never the retailer doing the screwing, rather the exclusive importer, wholesaler or middle man.*Originally Posted by 697F7A7A6B69656C6C6F6F0A0 link=1301294820/730#730 date=1305959835
Most Australians, retailers included and especially retailers I would think, would love to do away completely with exclusive distribution agreements and be able to import directly, parallel import, their goods for resale in Australia.* Prices would come down immensely, putting downward pressure on inflation and boosting the number of internet savvy Australians buying from Australian retailers.
Sure, there are downsides.* Warranty issues is one, but I imagine a thriving business of warranty providers emerging to fill the market gap.* But dont worry, shell be right.* It wont happen.* When it comes to free trade, Australia is all for it if it involves giving unfair advantages to other countries to buy up our country cheaply.* When it comes to consumers having a choice of free trade with other countries, however, no we dont want that and if you dare question it you get told to move overseas.
I am all for Australian retailers making our country a better place.* After all, small business is the engine room of the economy when it comes to creating new jobs.* Lets put into place legislative policies which help them, rather than hinder them by allowing them to source products at whatever price they can from wherever in the world they can.
I agree that it this is the best country on Earth. But just for a minute, have a think about this. By saying if you dont like things, here, move, dont you fall into exactly the trap which foreign companies and countries would like us to be in.Originally Posted by 517261616A4C57667D70727D130 link=1301294820/731#731 date=1305963758
After all, who controls the price of BMWs in Australia? BMW in Germany. Dont like it, move. No, let us decide where, how and how much of our money is spent ourselves. Your post is tantamount to saying, "If you dont love the way BMW Germany wants to make profits in Australia, move."
Well, I get a little offended when asked to justify my pricing, which is generally very competitive to local market.Originally Posted by 3635263D27203532322D540 link=1301294820/732#732 date=1305964117
Im also happy to deal with importers, etc. I dont have time or the expertise to scour the globe and Im very satisfied with the support I get from my suppliers, Breville included.
Government legislature to help me? Id settle for local council to sweep the footpath. ;DOriginally Posted by 3635263D27203532322D540 link=1301294820/732#732 date=1305964117
[movedhere] Brewing Equipment - Midrange ($500-$1500) [move by] Mal.
In cars, its comprehensively the govt. I guess its to support the builders of Commodes, Falcoms and whitegoods on wheels Craparys...Originally Posted by 5053405B41465354544B320 link=1301294820/732#732 date=1305964117
Thanks Mal for moving my comments to a more appropriate forum topic. Much appreciated.
Yes, for the tens of billions (Im not joking) of dollars poured into the local automotive sector over the last twenty years, we could have nationalised the car industry half a dozen times and still be ahead.Originally Posted by 4D787572465A767F7F7C7C190 link=1305923401/13#13 date=1305965281
And the Government is also responsible for a large duty charged on clothes brought into the country.
I may be completely wrong with my suggestion or allowing parallel importing of all good except for where it can be legitimately shown that there is a national economic, environmental or strategic advantage involved. Some things would fall into this category, but not much.
All Im asking for and what I think most people would find legitimate is spending a small amount for Treasury to analyse the pros and cons, the winners and losers and the general impact on Australias tax revenues, employment rates and general standard of living for parallel importation of goods, including cars.
My bet is inflation would go down, employment would go up, tax revenues would go up and the need / desire for so much middle class welfare would be reduced substantially.
I can completely understand that. Unfortunately I think you would find that comments along those lines are from people who dont understand the constraints, taxation regime and red tape you operate under. People who genuinely understand that artificial barriers have been put in place which hinders your ability to satisfy market demands at different price points dont blame the retailer. Im not one of those idiots who rant on to the register operator at petrol station that it is their fault about the petrol price. I would like to consider myself quite informed on matters such as these.Originally Posted by 7A6C6969787A767F7F7C7C190 link=1305923401/12#12 date=1305965208
Legislation can be positive or negative, but quite often fails due to our two party system of politics. Im on your side, as my previous comments has hopefully suggested.Originally Posted by 7A6C6969787A767F7F7C7C190 link=1305923401/12#12 date=1305965208
Originally Posted by 104F57414A414D444447474F434C220 link=1305923401/4#4 date=1305928843
;D I told Chris today you could get a roaster cheaper in America and he didnt even try and punch my lights out ;D ;D
The parent company plays a huge role in the prices we pay in Australia. Plenty of countries have Mercedes and BMWs as the mainstays of their taxi fleets, bet they dont pay AU prices for them ::)
;D ;D You didnt get to hear my internal dialogue trentski :POriginally Posted by 5254434852554D4F260 link=1305923401/15#15 date=1305972578
Well, with the car market, we have a big choice of good cars from all over the world. If we dont like the offer from BMW we dont need to move from Australia, it is easier to move to another brand with a better deal.Originally Posted by 2F2C3F243E392C2B2B344D0 link=1305923401/11#11 date=1305965147
Pretty sure if you reread my post, you will see this quoted to make the complete opposite point that I was trying to convey.Originally Posted by 210211111A3C27160D00020D630 link=1305923401/17#17 date=1305974645
I agree Barry, however, we are now in a global economy. Due to the size of our market (and a whole lot of other excuses) we do end up paying through the nose for certain products. The fact that many see and state this, it is a common point of frustration. I do not blame any retailers, especially small businesses for the prices they charge. Everyone has to make a living, and running a small business in Australia deserves to be well rewarded for the effort needed.Originally Posted by 6A495A5A51776C5D464B4946280 link=1305923401/8#8 date=1305963758
By saying that Australia is such a great place* to live in, and if you do not like it, then bugger off; is not the answer. There is nothing wrong with ensuring parity with the rest of the world, after all we are the consumers and we should be making the demands and setting the market price. We should not accept what companies overseas want to dictate to us.
As an interesting exercise, look what an imported well made car like a Porsche, BMW, Audi, Merc etc cost when the Australian dollar was worth Less than $0.70USD and under 50c Euro. It has now increased in value by almost 50%. That means these cars as a base price into Australia cost at least 30% less now. Is this reflected in the price of the aforementioned cars today? Hell no!
So, who is the sucker? The complacent consumer.
Australia is a great place to live in with great food etc like you mentioned. However, many countries in Europe with high standards of living also enjoy the same quality of food etc, but at cheaper prices. I have many* friends, family and colleagues who travel extensively, both for work and pleasure. Their thoughts and comments are very interesting. In a nutshell the conversation always goes, Australia is great but ...........
Another point, have you seen the cost of houses in the USA? We pay through the nose for houses here in comparison.
Moral is, stay in Australia, but lets push to make it an even better place to live.
I wont go down the path of my biggest bugbear (why tax thresholds are not increased according to CPI).
Is this possibly due to our present exchange rate?Originally Posted by 7B7C69666B080 link=1305923401/19#19 date=1306028824
When I was in the UK and Ireland six years ago, with the exchange rate then, everything cost about double of what we paid here at the time. The only cheap things in Europe then were airline tickets. Now we get many more pounds or euros than I got then for my A$. Now things would be much cheaper for us.
All this gets back to one thing, economies of scale, the bigger the population, the bigger the demand, the cheaper the price, in Australia, small population, smaller demand, higher prices, plus along way from the producer of the goods, so price relies on what the market here will bear, and that usually means higher prices.
Originally Posted by 657461677A20150 link=1305923401/21#21 date=1306048530
You can you explain to me why the higher population means lower price?
If a product is made for a global market then why would Australia pay more for it than America? They are making more to cater for the Australian market so cost should be less, not more
So what is it? Economies of scale (which I need you to explain a bit better) or is it "because they can"?Originally Posted by 657461677A20150 link=1305923401/21#21 date=1306048530
Go into Harvey Norman and ask for a price on a TV.* Then ask what the price would be if you bought 10 of the same TV.* Im betting the price per TV would drop a bit.Originally Posted by 3A3C2B203A3D25274E0 link=1305923402/22#22 date=1306062320
Its a simple analogy, but Im guessing its similar in terms of world trade...* USA sells a million units of X, Australia sells 100,000.* Guess who squeezes the best price out of the suppliers?
Plus, because the USA is a bigger market, there will be more retailers competing for a share of the very big pie.* And no doubt at any given time, any number of those retailers will be prepared to sell at ridiculously low margins to try to compete for their place, or establish their brand etc. etc.
Im no expert, but that to me is [s]economies[/s] benefits of scale.
Originally Posted by 42474B4F43484E11260 link=1305923402/23#23 date=1306108746
I think what you have described falls under "because they can" rather than economies/benefits of scale
(Puts on Economist hat) Economies of scale are present for some products in manufacture - the fixed costs of setting up a production line can be spread over more units making the per unit cost cheaper for a large production run. Clearly this aint totally true in this case as the products all come from the same Chinese factory wherever in the world they are going, but its likely that the production run for Australian voltage will be smaller than for the US 110V and there are likely to be some fixed costs involved in switching production from one to the other, which make it a little cheaper per unit to produce the larger production run of US voltage appliances.
Other partially fixed costs can arise from such things as setting up a distribution/service network and the costs of advertising- these tend to have a large fixed component (eg you still need at least one guy in each service centre trained to maintain the machines whether they are working on one warranty service a week or one hundred, the set up cost of a product website for each market etc); plus inter-country variance in wages costs and as has been mentioned before, taxation.
Another factor that can explain price difference across countries is variation in how demand varies with price changes. Technically speaking, firms will maximise profits by charging a higher price to markets where the price elasticity of demand is more inelastic (ie quantity demanded doesnt fall so much in response to a price rise). It seems likely that Australians have the bad habit of buying enough of higher priced goods to make it more profitable to sell fewer units at higher prices, than cut the prices and sell more units. We have a small market leading to a lack of competition at the retail sector. We get used to high prices and as long as we keep on paying them, manufacturers will keep on charging them if they are rational profit maximising firms.
(thus endeth the Economic 101 lecture)
I thought Milan, Naples and Florence were all in Italy?*Must explain how another site selling Chinese manufactured gear "stocks only equipment designed and built in [s]the Chinese prefecture of[/s] Europe"... ::)Originally Posted by 301610020D304D630 link=1305923402/25#25 date=1306112481
I had in mind the US/Aus price difference of thenew Breville product...!Originally Posted by 0B3E3334001C3039393A3A5F0 link=1305923402/26#26 date=1306113959
Im presuming that, for the Italian products, we are talking about relatively small scale exports of products* that involves large distribution costs, plus whatever adjustment to Australian conditions is required on a small production run. When you add the small market for higher end coffee machines in Australia (a function of both culture and population) I would imagine that the small retailers that sell these machines have zero bargaining power against the suppliers to negotiate on wholesale price, as they just dont sell sufficient numbers; however to sell they* have to be able to have both expertise and skills to service and demonstrate them well - its not suprising that the costs and therefore the retail price are high.
Its one of the inevitable downsides of a living in a small but geographically dispersed* market. But Id take that over living in London any day of the week (which is why Im here not there!)
Youre probably right... I started out thinking I was having a stab at explaining economies of scale, but got to the end and realised I hadnt done a very good job of it (thus crossing thru economies and replacing with benefit!).Originally Posted by 6F697E756F6870721B0 link=1305923402/24#24 date=1306112437
I think SusanS has now done a great deal better job of explaining the concept :D
P.S. if all else fails, you can always look up "economies of scale" on wikipedia!
Yep, but when it came to explaining why things are priced higher here, it boiled down to "because they can" >:(Originally Posted by 04010D09050E0857600 link=1305923402/28#28 date=1306122930
I disagree.Originally Posted by 585E4942585F47452C0 link=1305923402/29#29 date=1306123584
There were points regarding set up of productions lines to suit 110v vs 240v and the numbers produced at each.
The cost of establishing distribution and warranty/support networks where there is a lower volume of sales (i.e. cost per unit could be much higher to establish).
Dont get me wrong, it annoys me too - especially when we are talking EXACTLY the same product. I.e. no factors of modified production line due to different specs for different markets etc to push the price per unit up. And there are certainly aspects of both at play (economies of scale, AND "because they can").* The fact is, were a fraction the size of the USA or Europe.* Somehow I dont think a big global brand would lose too much sleep over losing the Aussie market.
In fact, even Breville (an Aussie company) has launched the best product in their history (coffee related, anyway) and stated the fact that the Australian market isnt their #1 priority.* Theyre chasing the US and Europe.* Good for them, but proves how highly valued, or otherwise, the Aussie market is...
For me, the biggest shame is that it will continue to drive consumers towards purchasing online for items that are practical to do so.* It will get to the point that we notice a significant impact on our local retail industry...* then well lament the lack of small businesses and competition in the retail industry, which in the end, could result in higher prices again.* All to save a few bucks on some clothes, designer perfume and a few blurays!
Last time I plugged in a 110V appliance at home, it seemed not to be EXACTLY the same.* :-?Originally Posted by 3F3A36323E35336C5B0 link=1305923402/30#30 date=1306124565
In order to add a little more complexity to this whole discussion, consider the following in the equation of who gets what cheaper.
Financially, we are far better off than our USA counterparts. Not only is our minimum wage about 50% better, we get more annual leave plus a 17.5% bonus, enjoy universal healthcare, university fees are cheaper, and more Australians own multiple homes than our American counterparts.
Yes, we are the lucky country, and yes, we, as well as other lucky countries, do and will continue to subsidise others for a myriad of reasons.
Think about it Trentski, why does a 2 door sports Commodor renamed a Buick and exported to the USA cost more in Oz, Oz doesnt subsidise exported goods, and if you were to export the same car from USA to Oz youd pay a lot more for it than those in the USA.
Originally Posted by 5E4F5A5C411B2E0 link=1305923402/33#33 date=1306133121
Yes economies of scale do exist in production of some goods where there a differences between markets. left and right hand drive cars, as per your example, 110 and 240 volt electrical goods.
What about 12 volt goods with switchmode power supplies? What about camera lenses? Clothes?
No difference between markets but the cost differences can be considerable.
By selling these items in more markets the economies of scale of production improve, sell to Australia and the unit price goes down, but they still charge more in Australia (more than the tax and freight difference), because they can.
Thats my point exactly, because they can, what ever the market will bear, due to population if you have 1% of the USA market in anything you are a millionaire, if you have 1% of the Oz market you go out of business, pure economics doesnt always explain everything.
I can appreciate how physical goods can be affected by various vagaries ultimately leading to price fluctuations that are on first glance, difficult to explain.
What really gets on my goat though, is software companies charging up to 80% more for downloaded software to purchase from an Aussie IP than it does to purchase exactly the same thing as a USA resident. That is nothing more than clear-cut extortion...
If you want to test this out, head to the Adobe website for example, and go to purchase something as a US resident and then as an Aussie. This is but one of many examples of this sort of thing.... >:(
I agree - a classic case of because they can.Originally Posted by 123F3B373A560 link=1305923402/36#36 date=1306138823
Agreed, I wasnt talking about the Breville there!* In fact Id offered that as one of the very reasons we might pay a but more here in oz in my previous post. As a drummer and hobbyist musician, I was thinking of cymbals, and other musical instruments... Cymbals are one that would travel pretty well, and Ive often considered buying from the states!Originally Posted by 0F3A37300418343D3D3E3E5B0 link=1305923402/31#31 date=1306125363
fromOriginally Posted by 0B26222E234F0 link=1305923402/36#36 date=1306138823
Justin Biebers album My Worlds costs $10.99 on Australian iTunes compared with $US6.99 for American customers ($6.57) and £5.99 in Britain ($9.10).
Susan Boyles I Dreamed A Dream costs $16.99 from iTunes in Australia, compared with just £4.99 in the UK ($7.60), €6.99 across Europe ($9.40) and $US10.99 in the US ($10.31).
The price variations mean Australians are being charged more than double the price iTunes charges in Britain and 80 per cent more than European customers.
The Social Network, the Oscar-winning story of the founders of Facebook, costs $24.99 in Australia, compared with $US14.99 in the US ($14.10) and £9.99 in the UK ($15.26) - or 77 per cent more in Australia than in the US.
Hugely popular game applications are also more expensive. Street Fighter IV is £2.99 in Britain ($4.55), $US4.99 in the US ($4.68) but it is $5.99 in Australia.
Because they can ::)
I am gonna bet that few here would be prepared to pay a zac for either of them!! ;DOriginally Posted by 5355424953544C4E270 link=1305923402/39#39 date=1306145801
Originally Posted by 74414C4B7F634F46464545200 link=1305923402/40#40 date=1306148211
A Zac Effron fan I see, well Im sure the High School Musical series are cheaper overseas as well ;)
I said young man, are you trying to tempt me?Originally Posted by 485E5B5B4A48444D4D4E4E2B0 link=1305923402/7#7 date=1305959835
Being a little selective with the quoting.....
You do of course have specific FACTUAL insider knowledge of this. And do you of course have factual knowledge of the kind of costs & reponsibilities to be carried when offering these products through a dealer and service network (unlike the usual direct selling system for these products in the US) ::)Originally Posted by 7E7D6E756F687D7A7A651C0 link=1305923402/9#9 date=1305964117
Putting my 3 cents on the table and in respect of the importing and business experience I have in the coffee machine business......which means I know what machines cost to purchase, ex manufacturer door, and the cost to import in number, & hold in stock for a period eating up interest on your overdraft so as to be able to offer retails clients choices and service.
Anyone in the US or here or anywhere, selling the equipment mentioned at the top of this thread, at the prices mentioned, is apparently losing real money for the privelege of being in business...the more machines they sell, the more money they lose, because there is no point selling equipment for less than your cost to buy, import, and open your door for business every morning (called "on costs" or the cost of doing business) BEFORE even making some actual back pocket type income. Income is something we are all entitled to make for our trouble :D
If someone in the US is suffering from the low economy and is offloading stock by all means buy it, bring it in, dont forget to INSURE IT IN TRANSIT door to door, pay all import costs, customs duty and GST, convert it to 240 volts, and add up the bill.
When it breaks down, add a bit more to the bill because there is no guarantee or support network.
And remember, DIY electrical conversions ALWAYS miss some of the most important stuff that stops you burning your house down.
I am certainly not trying to talk anyone out of DIY importing, as my own workshop will be happy to quote for a proper conversion and do the work if you approve of the price, and we will be happy to guarantee the work (and only the work) done for the usual service guarantee period of 3 months.
Please do account however for the parts that we supply to cost you more than you might buy them for directly, because when you buy a part you are responsible for the provision of all time spent. When we buy a part to supply to you in service and have to guarantee it and or the work for 3 months, we also have to consider adding a component for time to diagnose and repair or replace faulty parts and retest in the unfortunate event of a failure during the period of guarantee. IE there is extra cost to account for when extending the courtesy of a guarantee on parts & labour supplied in service. Its called carrying the ***responsibility*** and I think you will all agree that this is pretty fair as no one should be expected to work for nothing or lose money for the privelege of working for you.
Rgdz to all,
very first Cs site sponsor.
I recently went to replace a pair of shoes--made in Vietnam, exported all over the world as a "Brand-name".
Cost over the internet (Australia) $269.
From a real store (Australia)--Sorry, not made any more. The replacement model costs $259.
From a US website US$58 (plus US$30 DHL shipping--5 days delivery over Easter).
The first example is "a limited edition"Originally Posted by 0A3F282A1A223F202C21294D0 link=1305923402/44#44 date=1306251183
The second example is "latest model so expect to pay more"
The third example is, "a run out, end of line, or no one wants these anymore sale"
Hope they fit. ;D
How can I try on a pair of shoes over the net?Originally Posted by 1E2B3C3E0E362B3438353D590 link=1305923402/44#44 date=1306251183
I like to try before I buy. I put shoes on and walk around the store for a while to see how they fit.
I have learnt by experience how ill fitting shoes and ski boots can cripple my feet.
Bad ski boots :OOriginally Posted by 4D6E7D7D76504B7A616C6E610F0 link=1305923402/46#46 date=1306277342
I think the water or bamboo torture may well be preferable....
Originally Posted by 0E2F242423394A0 link=1305923402/45#45 date=1306269646
Now all the details come out. Now it makes sense why the prices were different.
Originally Posted by 2322776666120 link=1305923402/48#48 date=1306281619
Except that those were two different posts, so it was probably just a theory to explain the pricing difference.
I too bought some shoes a while back.* Highly recommended by a reputable running magazine. New model, au$259 rrp. Rebel sport $259. Specialist store in Albert Park - 20% discount. au$130 shipped from the uk by an international seller on the bay of evil, with Australian address to process returns.* Made in Thailand. For some products anyway, borders are becoming less relevant and those* businesses that manage the logistics stand to make money