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Thread: Wine for CoffeeSnobs

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    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    Wine for CoffeeSnobs

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    I'm guessing that the 'orally-obsessed' are probably broadly obsessed across the spectrum.
    I am and always have been unduly interested in anything that is drunk (is there a better way of saying that?) or eaten.

    I'm wondering if there would be any enduring interest here in an ongoing thread where Members post their assessments of popular, reasonably priced Australian wine they have tried.
    Having been a sometime contributor to the Auswine Forum, I am NOT talking about the sort of 'deep and meaningful' assessments that one finds on that worthy Forum, which are frankly beyond my level of expertise and interest (hints of boiled Macedonian Cabbage and flinty Calabrian Basalt - you know the type of thing).

    I was thinking more in terms of what Dan Murphys might be flogging as their "Wine of the week".
    There is always an inevitable tendancy towards 'oneupmanship' on these types of topics which results in someone wanting to enthuse about his 2009 Grange and I would prefer to avoid this kind of discussion in preference for more 'affordable' wines. 'Other sources' and 'References' from the net would be equally acceptable in advancing knowledge of particular wines as I always 'read-around' myself.
    This thread was prompted by Dan Murphy's ad for the Teusner 'The Riebke' 2013 Shiraz. The 2012 was by all accounts an absolute 'blinder' for around $20. and I am thinking that if this vintage is any good, I might put a half dozen of these down for a few years. At $17. could be a good buy. Any thoughts?

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    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I'm guessing that the 'orally-obsessed' are probably broadly obsessed across the spectrum.
    I am and always have been unduly interested in anything that is drunk (is there a better way of saying that?) or eaten.
    Tsk, tsk. Wine should be quaffed, not 'drunk' .

    This thread was prompted by Dan Murphy's ad for the Teusner 'The Riebke' 2013 Shiraz. The 2012 was by all accounts an absolute 'blinder' for around $20. and I am thinking that if this vintage is any good, I might put a half dozen of these down for a few years. At $17. could be a good buy. Any thoughts?
    I actually tried some of this at a restaurant dinner last night. Very nice wine to 'drink' now but I didn't check the label closely enough for cellaring potential. I'm going to buy some though.

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    Member twwen2's Avatar
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    Vinomofo is a great source of discounted (sometimes up to 60%), high-quality wines with the assessment and commentary legwork already done for you. The only catch is that you need to buy in lots of 6 or 12. My usual approach is to stick to those that have been awarded gold medals or have been rated as >=95pts by an industry reviewer. Generally speaking for reds, the 2010 vintages are offering good value for money and are already drinking well. Some of the newer 2012 releases are getting good write-ups also.

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    Senior Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    I like my reds, although personally I think almost every Merlot I have tried is 'Chateau le Cardboard' in flavour. I'll try a Pinot though. My preference is a Shiraz or a good Cab Sav. I've tried a few Granges across the years and think it's greatly overpriced - a St Henri from the same maker is a much better choice.

    Having said that, I also buy el cheapo shiraz's to quaff while watching movies etc. or to have at my side while writing at the PC. I'll pay a visit to Dan's and try the Riebke - a $20 blinder promises good things. Mind you 2013 is grown in 2012 - might have been a bit wet for good big reds, but at $16.90 at Dan's it's worth a try.

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    Member twwen2's Avatar
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    My favorite value-for-money reds so far are:

    - 2011/2012 Art of War Shiraz ($15, Vinomofo Exclusive)
    - 2011 Wyndham Estate Bin 888 Cab Merlot (~$15)
    - 2011 Wyndham Estate Bin 555 Shiraz (~$15)

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    Senior Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    I remember downing a LOT of the Bin 444 & 555 - did a few of the 888's as well but preferred the other 2. Nice drop. Indulged too much of the 555 one night and broke 5 ribs - thought I could leap over a railway garden bed and found ribs to be less resilient than bluestone rock. That's about 15 years back - haven't had any of that in a while. I'll have to look around for it next time wine shopping. Thanks for the reminder.

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    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    Thanks Flynnaus, sounds like it could be worth a trip to Uncle Dans to slosh some round the tonsils.

    Twwen2 - I envy you guys in the Capital cities in relation to the availability of good discount outlets that provide the full range of services from tastings to assessments/ratings of their wines.
    I long ago gave up on buying interstate or ex-winery due to the shipping costs and volume issues. Nowdays I like to just rock up to Uncle Dan's and buy a few of something good when the mood takes me.

    Journeyman - I like a good wine of any kind - grape variety unimportant. You generally have to pay bigger dollars to get good Merlots and Pinots and consequently I don't drink as many of these as I would like.
    My plan is usually to buy something with really good reviews cheaply and cellar it for 5 -10 years. This has worked a treat over 40 years or so, although today there are many moderately priced reds that are ready to drink immediately, whereas 30 years ago much of the young moderately priced stuff was rocket-fuel.

    What else have folks bought recently in the $15. range that's good? (preferably not obscure stuff that is only available in the capital cities)
    (I've pretty-well given up on Penfolds which is over-priced right across the range.)

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journeyman View Post
    I like my reds, although personally I think almost every Merlot I have tried is 'Chateau le Cardboard' in flavour.
    On the money there Jm! Unfortunately someone stuffed up and went through the trouble of importing ( Australia takes about 12 years from import, quarantine and

    cultivation to commercial production of vine stock ) one of the worst/ most unsuitable clones of Merlot; namely, D3V14.

    Widely planted, widely grafted over to other varieties, universally condemned. Other, better clones available now.

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    Hi Rocky, as mentioned by twwen2, vinomofo is a great source at that price range. Just checked their FAQ and they do ship to remote areas. I've bought enough from them to receive the personal sales call (disclaimer: not an alcoholic, just combined orders with friends)! It's a bit of a gamble when you haven't tried something, but to be honest I've not gone too far wrong in $12-$25 range with regions and varietals I like, all around 94pt mark. I'm not sure about those wine scales. They seem to only run between 91-96 points. Intuitively you'd think, say, a 70pt would be "eminently drinkable at a moderate price".

    I'm also into big reds and have had some pretty decent shiraz/cab/grenache/etc from SA and Vic. Highlights for me have been:

    - Ross Estate 'Lights Out' Barossa Valley Grenache 2009 around $10/bottle
    - Hither & Yon Grenache Mataro Shiraz 2012 for $16
    - RedCote Shiraz 2010 at $20

    A lot of them seem to be in half dozen boxes and they have a flat $9 delivery fee, so if you can combine with friends you can try a few without ordering an embarrassing amount of booze for yourself.

    Sorry - didn't mean for this post to read like a commercial plug for them, it's just made wine purchasing a real armchair activity for me (as opposed to wine drinking, which already was firmly armchair based).

    It's interesting the posts so far have generally been about big reds. I'd hazard a guess that a lot people here who like coffee on their palette also have some similar other tastes. Shiraz, tea, dark chocolate, smokey Islay scotch etc.

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    Senior Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    Other, better clones available now.
    Ah... any ideas as to which makers might have the newer versions. Been a LOOONG time since I tried a Merlot after many years of people telling me how wonderful (insert label here) was and finding it unpalatable.

    In whites I like a Verdelo (aka Verdelhao and a few other versions) a Columbard and a crisp chilled Chablis - except for the 1st, I think the others aren't on shelves any more. Most Chardonnays aren't much chop since the latté set started in on them - ruined a perfectly good market.

    We have a local maker - Ellis Wines - who do a very nice Premium Shiraz but it's circa $25 per, so not really a cheapie. Rutherglen used to make a very nice Sparkling Shiraz that was excellent slightly chilled - sounds strange but it works.

    Anyone remember the old days of Chateau Le Gopener? Spumante, Barossa Pearl, Cold Duck, Bodega, Starwine and Ben Ean? I saw a bottle of Ben Ean in DM's a while back and after an anticipatory shudder realised there might still be a market for Chateau Le Plonk among the younger set.

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journeyman View Post
    Ah... any ideas as to which makers might have the newer versions. Been a LOOONG time since I tried a Merlot after many years of people telling me how wonderful (insert label here) was and finding it unpalatable.

    In whites I like a Verdelo (aka Verdelhao and a few other versions) a Columbard and a crisp chilled Chablis - except for the 1st, I think the others aren't on shelves any more. Most Chardonnays aren't much chop since the latté set started in on them - ruined a perfectly good market.
    Won't be in the price bracket this thread is aimed at, but Tarrawarra Estate have one, from clone Q45-14.

    For the most part retailers won't know their clones but googling Merlot clones 8R, PDFS and the one above may yield some results.

    Chablis is no longer available as a wine name in Australia as its a region in France with an Appéllation.

    Unwooded Chardonnay is the equivalent here, now.

    Colombard is still widely grown but finding it as single varietal might be difficult. Blended
    with Chardonnay, some examples can be found and might be a start in locating as a single variety.

    Vinitasse may be able throw some light on it too.

    Chardonnay - Colombard Wine Grape Variety Information

    John Ellis used to make a cracker Colombard when he headed up Tisdall Wines in Echuca, google them.... I
    don't know if they still exist.

    What's wrong with the Chardy?? ;-)

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    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    Won't be in the price bracket this thread is aimed at, but Tarrawarra Estate have one, from clone Q45-14.

    For the most part retailers won't know their clones but googling Merlot clones 8R, PDFS and the one above may yield some results.

    Chablis is no longer available as a wine name in Australia as its a region in France with an Appéllation.

    Unwooded Chardonnay is the equivalent here, now.

    Colombard is still widely grown but finding it as single varietal might be difficult. Blended
    with Chardonnay, some examples can be found and might be a start in locating as a single variety.

    Vinitasse may be able throw some light on it too.

    Chardonnay - Colombard Wine Grape Variety Information

    John Ellis used to make a cracker Colombard when he headed up Tisdall Wines in Echuca, google them.... I
    don't know if they still exist.

    What's wrong with the Chardy?? ;-)
    Thanks for the intro Chokki ;-)

    As for a Chablis style wine, you don't necessarily have to stoop to un-oaked Chardonnays as there are more than a few true Chablis that have been exposed to some, usually older and therefore muted, oak. What you want to look for is a Chardonnay that has not gone through malo-lactic fermentation, meaning that there is none of that butteryness of the bigger Chards and it also means that the sharp, fresh green apple acids (malic acid primarily) are front and centre. A Chablis style wine should be crisp and flinty with a wee hint of cheesy goodness on the back palate. We make a brilliant one at Paringa Estate... the 2012 Peninsula Chardonnay... and it will set you back just $22.00 This wine is absolutely brilliant! It was barrel fermented in older French oak barrels, it was kept "sur lie" (on the dead yeast cells) for an extended period of time and this lends a touch of bready, yeasty, cheesy and very French notes to the wine and the crisp malic acid keeps everything fresh and in balance. In a blind tasting most would assume this was a true Chablis. Well worth a look.

    As for Colombard, this varietal is a rather quirky cross of a very obscure French varietal and Chenin Blanc. You may find it easier to search Dan Murphy's for a Chenin Blanc as these tend to be growing in popularity while Colombard is very much on the decline in terms of consumer demand. Happy hunting and even happier drinking! :-)
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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Thanks for chiming in Vinitasse!

    You're at Paringa!! One of my all time favourite cool climate Shiraz, up there with Pat Carmody @ Craiglee..... next to my own, ..of course ;-).... Mea Culpa.

    I remember the 2008 Paringa Estate shiraz, first seeing it at the 2010 RASV Melbourne Wineshow, did you get a gong? (my 2008 chard trophied best single vineyard).

    Being a grape grower (ex) I take first claim for a wines quality and just glad the winemaker didn't stuff it up!! ;-)

    I recently saw a bottle of 2008 Paringa Shiraz for sale, I was sorely tempted on the day but next time I'm close to the store I'll see if it's still there.

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    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    Thanks for chiming in Vinitasse!

    You're at Paringa!! One of my all time favourite cool climate Shiraz, up there with Pat Carmody @ Craiglee..... next to my own, ..of course ;-).... Mea Culpa.

    I remember the 2008 Paringa Estate shiraz, first seeing it at the 2010 RASV Melbourne Wineshow, did you get a gong? (my 2008 chard trophied best single vineyard).

    Being a grape grower (ex) I take first claim for a wines quality and just glad the winemaker didn't stuff it up!! ;-)

    I recently saw a bottle of 2008 Paringa Shiraz for sale, I was sorely tempted on the day but next time I'm close to the store I'll see if it's still there.
    If you thought the '08 Estate Shiraz was good, wait until you try the '08 or -'09 "The Paringa" Single Vineyard Shiraz! Might have to trade a bottle for some of your single vineyard chard.
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    Member twwen2's Avatar
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    As den78 mentioned, Vinomofo is online-only and ship Australia wide. Find a mate or two to split the cases with and sign up for their daily emails. I challenge you to not make a purchase every week!

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    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    Ha! no thanks twwen2 - been there, done that. Not interested in online wine. I like to wander at leisure through Uncle Dan's place and try to pick the good buys. Over the years I have got to know the fine wine specialist at DMs and have a lot of faith in his opinions, but it's still nice to have a few recommendations from other wine lovers.
    Like Journeyman, I love my whites, particularly some of the less popular varieties like Fume Blanc, Colombard, Verdelho.
    I'm not a fan of Sauvignon Blanc as I find most are too dry and lacking in flavour. I like my good whites with a little bit of age to soften and develop the character, not everybody's choice, I know.
    Unlike some of little faith, I have never wavered in my love of Chardonnay in it's many incarnations - the trendies and hipsters don't matter to me, I drink whats good.

    However, it's REDS that I'm on about here. Now I know one of our own is a winemaker, I will look for some Paringa Estate.

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    However, it's REDS that I'm on about here. Now I know one of our own is a winemaker, I will look for some Paringa Estate.
    Like a good coffee snob one should never forget the farmer :-D.........

    Look out for Giant Steps 'Tarraford Vineyard' 2004-2012 vintages as well as 'Mea Culpa' 2010-2012 (99%-100% Tarraford shiraz)

    :-D
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    Senior Member Journeyman's Avatar
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    Thanks Vinitasse - I will give it a try.

    @Rocky - re the Chardonnays. About a decade back (or more) I lost hope in them. The café set had discovered them and the good ones left my price bracket - when I good get an excellent Shiraz for half the price of a drinkable Chardy I gave up. Chablis' and Columbard had vanished and most Sauv Blancs were, I swear, decanted from Chateau le Plastic and the reds were on the rise in popularity so there were lots of good stuff to choose from at reasonable prices.

    In my online browse yesterday, inspired by this thread, I came across this blog, Lindemans and got very sad and nostalgic for the days long gone. What have they done to our wine industry.

    Fortunately things are heading back to where they were with lots of smaller places providing some excellent wines for us to savour in our (well, my) dotage.

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    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    I'm going to buy some (Teusner 'The Riebke' 2013 Shiraz) though.
    Bought a half-dozen. There is no cellaring info so it's a drink ... sorry, quaff now wine.

    Which raises the question: how long can you reasonably store a non-vintage wine (red and white)?

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Non vintage or NV wines.... without a production date you'll always be guessing.

    I wouldn't bother unless its an NV Champagne ( not Aus/NZ sparkling).

    Well over 90 % of Australian wine is drunk within a week of purchase so most
    mid priced wines are made to be attractive and drinkable when quite young.

    Cellaring will not improve an average wine, it will just become an old average wine or deteriorate altogether.
    Different varieties will cellar for different lengths of time and most good Australian wine, that can be cellared, is best consumed within 10 years of vintage.
    Grange is an exception; it is constructed to mature over 20 years.

    Riesling, for instance, will be fresh, aromatic, flinty and crisp when young with delicate fruit; cellar it for 3 years and you might find it a bit flat,
    cellar it for 7-10 years and you might be blown away by it's honeyed lusciousness.

    Getting to know the compatibility of varieties with grape growing regions is crucial for selecting wines to cellar.
    Awareness of the particular weather during any one growing season will also help.

    A dry, hot year may result in low natural acid and a lack of structure and balance and give coarse, harsh tannins.
    Conversely an overly cool, wet cloudy year (2011), will result in unripe tannins, a lack of full flavour ripeness, low sugar, high acid,
    (unbalanced acid/sugar )and a higher incidence of disease.

    Closures will also influence ageing, Stelvin ( screwcap ) will retain more fresh and aromatic fruit flavours, whilst cork may result in a 'corked' wine
    or allow the wine to develop more complex, nuanced and rich flavours. Cork may lead to premature oxidation whilst Stelvin
    may lead to reduction, initially, or rapid oxidation after 10 years when the plastic liner deteriorates.

    Australia is not France and stories of 20+ year old wines that still drink well are rare. Approximately 1% of world wines
    will significantly improve with this length of time.

    And remember to sample your wine regularly, so that you catch it just before or as it peaks.....
    after that it's all downhill. :-( ........better to drink too young than too old.
    Last edited by chokkidog; 2nd May 2014 at 01:12 PM.
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    'orally-obsessed' is this some sort of sexual variation? :-)

    I don't drink alcohol

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    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Thanks for the informed response chokkidog and I've checked off 'learn something new today'

    Riesling will be fresh, aromatic, flinty and crisp
    Funny you should mention that as I was just reading a novel set in pre-war Nazi Germany (~1937) where two characters were enjoying a ?1920 Riesling but I think you may have covered that by
    Australia is not France and stories of 20+ year old wines that still drink well are rare
    Hmm...sample regularly. How is that done? If I understand correctly, once it was via a syringe through the cork but how would you manage with screwcap bottles? In the end it all sounds rather complex for the average punter (or slightly above average, like me) and your closing sentence may be the best advice.

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    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    I spent a while in DM this morning talking with the fine wine specialist.
    We sampled the Teusner which he opened for that purpose. It had a very nice flowery bouquet and lots of fruit on the palate although a fair bit of acidity (not unexpected). He said I should have phoned him and he would have opened one and given it a bit of breathing space as it was a bit dumb at tasting. I did like it however and felt it would be a good drink now once it caught its breath or a good longer-term cellar proposition.
    I asked him to nominate a couple of other "as good or better" $17. reds and he showed me these three:
    Saltram 2012 1859 Barossa Shiraz for $16.99 and Angoves 2012 'Vineyard Select' McLarenVale Shiraz for $15.99. Yalumba 2011 "Patchwork" Barossa Shiraz for $17.99.
    Also mentioned their special on Kellermeister 2012 Barossa Shiraz for $12.90 ea(case buy) which he thinks is the best value red in the shop.
    I ended up buying the Yalumba plus a bottle each of the Saltrams and the Kellermeister to try.
    Before I left we had a glass of 2009 St Henri (opened prev. afternoon) with a lovely tarry nose and a trace of the familiar 'fruit cake' characters. The DM tasting notes mention that it is still quite closed and I'd agree with that. I'd like to have a case of this in the cellar for about 2020.

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    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    My cellar (aka the back room and a few well-insulated central cupboards) contain quite a bit of cheaper French and Spanish wine that I've picked up through one of the major online dealers. Much softer, less heavy on the tannins than similarly priced Aussie wines, so makes a good contrast. Tending towards WA wines domestically, but I have my favourites from most regions. Of the wines stocked in many supermarkets/bottle shops, I quite like the current vintage of the Brokenwood Cricket Pitch white blend. I used to really like the Jacobs Creek 'Reserve' range reds, but predictably the early vintages were 'over-engineered' to get market share.recognition, and the more recent vintages appeal less to my taste.

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    Thanks for the informed response chokkidog and I've checked off 'learn something new today'

    Funny you should mention that as I was just reading a novel set in pre-war Nazi Germany (~1937) where two characters were enjoying a ?1920 Riesling but I think you may have covered that by [/COLOR]

    Hmm...sample regularly. How is that done? If I understand correctly, once it was via a syringe through the cork but how would you manage with screwcap bottles? In the end it all sounds rather complex for the average punter (or slightly above average, like me) and your closing sentence may be the best advice.
    Cheers, flynn! How do you sample? Throw away the syringe, buy enough to open a bottle every year after the first two or three (years)!

    If you can buy a case you might costume 4-6 bottles and then have 6 or more for the last couple of years!! Bit like tracking
    a coffee but over a (considerably ) different time frame.

    The trick is to know when to pull the pin and have a party!! ;-D

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    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    Like Journeyman, I love my whites, particularly some of the less popular varieties like Fume Blanc, Colombard, Verdelho.
    I'm not a fan of Sauvignon Blanc as I find most are too dry and lacking in flavour.
    Just thought I would add to the whole "learning something new everyday" trend with... FYI, Fume Blanc is Sauvignon Blanc.

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    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I spent a while in DM this morning talking with the fine wine specialist.
    Sounds like you got more of a show than I did. The guy who talked to me only commented on the great value for money of the Teusner. But I was in a hurry and the drop I had the other night was enough to convince me.

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    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinitasse View Post
    Just thought I would add to the whole "learning something new everyday" trend with... FYI, Fume Blanc is Sauvignon Blanc.
    Sometimes used synonymously, sometimes fermented all or in part in old oak, á la Mondavi in California, who first used the term.

    Sort of adapted from the Pouilly Fumé (France) where one of the local types of Sauvignon Blanc is fermented in barrels with a high level of toasting.

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    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    I've been tasting wine with this particular gent for a long time so he knows I'm not just wasting his time.
    I think I will still buy some of the Teusner as it seemed like it would have the legs for the long haul.
    Still interested to know what others think of this particular wine - is it value at the price?

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    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I've been tasting wine with this particular gent for a long time so he knows I'm not just wasting his time.
    I think I will still buy some of the Teusner as it seemed like it would have the legs for the long haul.
    Still interested to know what others think of this particular wine - is it value at the price?
    I've never had a bad drop from Teusner... so if you like those southern Rhone-esque spicy reds then its really up to you to determine if the pricepoint works for you or not. Sounds like a no-brainer to me.

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    Rocky, I find taste in wine to be very personal. Buy what you like, and yes Teusner make nice wines. As to value, that is something only you can perceive.
    I grew up next to the Barossa and enjoyed discovering all the little wineries that are now immensely popular, but back then were relatively unknown. I still prefer and buy wine from them. Few of the wines I like are stocked by DM. They are a great source for wine if you live in far Nth QLD. I still prefer to support the small guys and buy direct from wineries or boutique sellers of fine wine. My consumption is very moderate, so I prefer to buy something that I am really going to enjoy.
    Great Barossa reds under $20 are rare.
    My preference lies with wines from Rockfords, Tim Smith, Turkey Flat, Charles Melton etc.
    Sometimes, talented winemakers working at large (or small) wineries will be inspired to buy some quality grapes and make a small parcel of quality wine on their own, which they then sell as their own label. Some of these have been magnificent but are not easy to buy from regular channels.

    I don't agree with a lot of the recommendations by the people at DM, and will only buy a new label from them if I can taste it first. As I said taste in wine is very personal, and I find they tend to push products which they need to move. However, others enjoy what DM suggest and are happy, so each to their own.

  32. #32
    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    It goes without saying that wine, or any other product is about personal taste.
    I am one of those people who believes in 'absolutes' however - good, bad, indifferent
    I generally find that the wine I enjoy is well received by most other people who seriously like wine - hence my interest in what others are enjoying.
    I find that DM have as big a range of wine as I will ever want and my occasional flirtations with boutique outfits and small producers does not justify the effort.
    I have never known the wine specialist at my local DM to push a product, and equally I have found his recommendations sound. An example of this is the Kellermeister I mentioned above. I drank part of that bottle tonight and thought it lived up to his recommendation as one of the best value reds I have tasted. Give it a try and see what you think.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by twwen2 View Post
    Vinomofo is a great source of discounted (sometimes up to 60%), high-quality wines with the assessment and commentary legwork already done for you. The only catch is that you need to buy in lots of 6 or 12. My usual approach is to stick to those that have been awarded gold medals or have been rated as >=95pts by an industry reviewer. Generally speaking for reds, the 2010 vintages are offering good value for money and are already drinking well. Some of the newer 2012 releases are getting good write-ups also.
    big fan of them too. almost always delivers (pun intended) on their products. yes, blind buying has it's setbacks, but i've found that when i dont like it, heaps of my other friends do, so they get to enjoy it! whats more, i get to recruit them to share cases with me for future orders, making the risks lower and still getting great wines for good prices

    BUT i do however believe that there are absolutes on wines - crap, and indifferent. some work and some dont for me while the complete opposite can happen with a wine to friends with similar passions for taste. there are so many factors to what we taste - our mood, what we've had before drinking the wine (and even what we've had to eat for the past month) and what kind of day we've had. but some wines just suck. the rest im going to just say im indifferent on. =p

  34. #34
    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    Yes, some folks take the position that there is no 'good or 'bad' - only your own personal preference.
    That probably works if you don't intend getting in to the 'entity' - whatever it might be - in any depth, but if you want to discuss it with other equally interested parties then you need to be able to establish some 'standards' against which to assess examples. I occasionally find I 'see' a wine differently from the experts, but I'm happy to defer to their superior, knowledge, training and experience.
    An e.g. I can think of is the budget-priced DeBortoli Windy Peak Pinot Noir. I can remember drinking numerous bottles of this several years ago and thinking it was pretty ordinary, even though the experts consistently said it was a very good cheap Pinot. I'm sure it is - just not my taste although I do like Pinots a lot - the popular Ninth Island is probably closer to what I like for a reasonable price.
    Anybody given the Kellermeister a go yet?

  35. #35
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    I have a semi-cleanskin (i.e. the capsule has 'Trevor Jones' written on it) of a previous Kellermeister shiraz. Quite like it, but happy to let it develop a little more. Probably a 2010 or earlier as Trevor left Kellermeister around that time.

  36. #36
    Senior Member sidewayss's Avatar
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    Vinnitase,
    Dont suppose you know a Mr Eldridge from Eldridge Wineries?
    He used to be active on the forum.
    Compared to the Paringa Pinot Noirs, the Eldridge Pinot is softer on the palate, the Paringa more fuller bodied and juicy.

    They are both great wines and I have sold lots of both at the restaurant.

  37. #37
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    I'm 3 bottles in to the 2013 tuesner. It's pretty good but I think I liked the 2011 better. Missed out in the 2012 release somehow!!

    Waiting for someone to comment on the kellermeister

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    Being from the Hunter and having spent a bit of time working in the vineyards, my favorite winemaker is Andrew Thomas, if you can try some of his stuff its worth a shot.

  39. #39
    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skippy View Post
    Being from the Hunter and having spent a bit of time working in the vineyards, my favorite winemaker is Andrew Thomas, if you can try some of his stuff its worth a shot.
    I'll second that notion!

  40. #40
    Senior Member Vinitasse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sidewayss View Post
    Vinnitase,
    Dont suppose you know a Mr Eldridge from Eldridge Wineries?
    He used to be active on the forum.
    Compared to the Paringa Pinot Noirs, the Eldridge Pinot is softer on the palate, the Paringa more fuller bodied and juicy.

    They are both great wines and I have sold lots of both at the restaurant.
    Wasn't aware that he was a Coffee Snob as well. Will have to chat him up about that. While I'll agree that his Pinots are softer than ours at the top end, keep in mind that we have 3 tiers when it comes to our Pinots and our Peninsula series definitely sits at the soft, feminine and delicate end of the scale. Our Estate series is bigger and bolder and a definite New World take on the varietal while our The Paringa Single Vineyard is a big, ballsy, eat it with a spoon while sitting in front of the fireplace with a Cohiba Esplendido Old World monster... in a good way of course.

  41. #41
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    Well as I am new..go easy... I find most of the Bendigo wines are good quaffing, Tyrrells Rufus Stone... Blue Pyrenees (similar spelling)
    Barry O'Speedwagon likes this.

  42. #42
    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
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    Hi Bagis, welcome.
    I am a longtime fan of anything Tyrrells, and also Blue Pyrenees of which I currently have 4 of the 2009 Estate Cab Sav in the cellar, which I am hoping will be good around 2015.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
    I'm not a fan of Sauvignon Blanc as I find most are too dry and lacking in flavour. I like my good whites with a little bit of age to soften and develop the character, not everybody's choice, I know.
    Oh dear, I came in here hoping to get some suggestions for some new sav blancs and when I CTRL-F I only found this...
    Anyway, I've a very easy to please palette but I absolutely love the Marlborough sav blancs, Geison and the like.
    Anyone have a recommendation on other good regions?
    Thanks.

  44. #44
    Senior Member sidewayss's Avatar
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    You cant go wrong with the Marlborough region for good easy going sav blancs. On the other token, there are also some more complex ones there.
    Oyster Bay and Babich are easy going SBs.
    Here in WA, Frog Belly by Warner Glen, Madfish Bay and Cape Mentell are just a few from Margaret River region.
    In South Australia, Adelaide hills have a lot of good offerings

  45. #45
    Senior Member Barry O'Speedwagon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sidewayss View Post
    You cant go wrong with the Marlborough region for good easy going sav blancs. On the other token, there are also some more complex ones there.
    Oyster Bay and Babich are easy going SBs.
    Here in WA, Frog Belly by Warner Glen, Madfish Bay and Cape Mentell are just a few from Margaret River region.
    In South Australia, Adelaide hills have a lot of good offerings
    Love the Cape Mentelle white. Also like another WA sem sav blanc by Bussell. I think I overdid the Marlborough sav blancs and found myself looking for a change.

    I have however, developed quite a liking for a couple of NZ pinot noirs....Mt Rosa and Mt Difficulty (the former being a bit more affordable).

  46. #46
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    Seems we're talking foreign wines .........

    Have a crack at a Sancerre, the ancestral home of Sauvignon Blanc, an appellation in the Loire Valley, France.

    DM's have an affordable range, well within the scope of this thread, circa $20;

    Domaine des Grosses Pierres, Pierre Brevin & Brochard.

    Something different from the capsicum, cat's pee, cut grass of the new world examples.

    Some good WA examples, blended with Semillon, (as mentioned above).....Mentelle, Madfish, Devils Lair, Catching Thieves.
    Last edited by chokkidog; 11th May 2014 at 04:42 PM.

  47. #47
    Senior Member chokkidog's Avatar
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    BO'S..........+1 for the Mt Difficulty pinot. Central Otago value.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by sidewayss View Post
    You cant go wrong with the Marlborough region for good easy going sav blancs. On the other token, there are also some more complex ones there.
    Oyster Bay and Babich are easy going SBs.
    Here in WA, Frog Belly by Warner Glen, Madfish Bay and Cape Mentell are just a few from Margaret River region.
    In South Australia, Adelaide hills have a lot of good offerings
    Yes, looove the Oyster Bay. Will look out for Babich , probably already tried it but need to see the bottle to remember.
    Are those WA ones straight SB or Sem SB? I haven't found many sem savs that I really love and most WA offerings seem to blend sem and SB.
    Can you recommend a good SA SB? (too many acronyms? sorry).

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by chokkidog View Post
    Seems we're talking foreign wines .........

    Have a crack at a Sancerre, the ancestral home of Sauvignon Blanc, an appellation in the Lore Valley, France.

    Domaine des Grosses Pierres, Pierre Brevin & Brochard.

    Something different from the capsicum, cat's pee, cut grass of the new world examples.
    Sounds good chokkidog, I'll keep an eye open. I'd love try a different type of sav blanc.

  50. #50
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    Sidewayss, is that name from the movie?
    It is my wife and my favorite movie.
    We were down in Margaret River a few years back and it was showing at one of the wineries (that has the outdoor cinema, I can't believe I can't remember which winery).
    We sat on the lawn of a winery, in our favorite wine region, with a bottle of the winery's wine, with a bunch of good-natured folk (who laughed in all the right spots), watching our favorite wine movie of all time. Amazing.



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