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Thread: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

  1. #1
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Im in the market for a video camera and thought I would post a query on a coffee forum.
    :-?
    Strange I know, but hey, I trust you guys (well most of you)
    ;)

    Criteria? *Not sure yet. *

    Im replacing a JVC mini DVD camera (model: GR DVL820EA) which has served us well for many years and would like to get something smaller (so it gets taken with us more often)

    An hour in Dick Smith Powerhouse "did my head-in" with so many options and features. *Tape, DVD, HDD, SD card are all options for output as is 4:3 or 16:9(crop) or "true 16:9" etc etc. *Ticket prices ranged from $500-$2500 on the shop floor and Im sure the sky is the limit (if your pocket can handle it).

    The 40GB HDD JVC Everio 3CCD looked cute but at $1800 is sort of on the high side of what I could/should spend. *

    Sony had a 1CCD one with a 60GB HDD for circa $1500

    Could get any variety of record to mini DVD cameras for $1000

    And if it writes to miniDV tape you can get a mile of choices for around $700

    The picture below is a Sanyo gizmo (from the web) that writes to SD cards (which are cheap now) and is very small and I assume has great battery life due to the lack of moving parts. *A 1GB SD is around the price of a mini-DV tape and a whole lot smaler in your pocket so to carry a pile of cards would be no drama.

    So anyway... the real question is are there any CSrs who have a current model video camera and can offer-up some tips on what is good or bad?




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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    I use the JVC a bit filming a friend on tracks days and races and its very nice to use and looks to give a good picture

    those SD card things arent worth the plastic they are punched out of, how much video and what quality does 1gig give you? could be as low as 15mins to get good quality so cost of cards gets pretty dear if you want to match the capacity of a HDD model

    I would go with anything that can transfer the video to your pc easily, gives enough minutes to film what you will need to film and feels good in your hand

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Youd get better quality pictures, Andy with that 3CCD camera over the 1CCD, I should think. In regards to that, I guess you need to decide what you will be filming and how important you place quality of picture over price.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    A few reviews here...

    http://www.pcauthority.com.au/review.aspx?CIaRCID=36

    But youre right Andy, so much information and Jargon.. even for an IT guy like me... ::)

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    3CCD explained

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3CCD

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Having used a video camera with a DV tape for the last few years I have concluded that my next one will have a hard drive (or maybe flash if the memory is big enough). Transferring DV tape across to the laptop to create a DVD of home movies is a pain and slow. It would be nice to be able to work directly off the cameras HD to burn the videos as it will save heaps of time. Copying from a HD to the laptops HD would also be much quicker. At the moment it takes an hour to copy 1 hour of DV tape across.

    Remember that 1 hour of DV tape will take up about 4 gb of hard drive to convert across at max resolution. Therefore I would assume that if you want to record at the best resolution then you would have to have at least 4gb of memory in the camera for every 1 hr of recording.

    I also have my eye on the JVCs. Also watching in a 16:9 format is nice, you seem to be able to capture so much more of what is happening.

    My first crack worth ;)

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Andy,

    Welcome to CameraSnobs - the CoffeeSnobs for camera users ;D.... and just like the choices for newbies with coffee equipment the world of electronics is no less confusing..... so in Coffee terms!

    3CCD vs 1 CCD is like trying to blend coffee (of the same bean variety) at three different roast levels.... preroast is 1CCD and post roast is 3CCD..... the post roast will give far better results!

    Those cameras with memory cards are like the Euro coffee machines on Evilbay (do I need to say more) and the rest vary between a Silvia and a Synesso..... and just like those coffee machines you need to match your requirements to the "features" of each camera. What is overkill for some ( a two group commercial machine for home use? ;) ;D ;D ;D) is essential for others.

    Id go to a direct to DVD recorder... with whatever features are needed.... any reputable brand... and if high quality images are the go.... 3CCD. And 16:9 is the standard for digital TV.... which shortly will be the only sets available.... so yep, that as well.

    Hope that helps...

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Tape reliability over HHD ??? This alone is worth discussion within the context of this thread...

    While I agree a HHD would be "faster"... reliability of HHD this size (physically) would be my concern... After your 12months warrantee passes, I wonder what a HHD replacement cost is... it would be an eye opener.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    JavaB is right... and perhaps DVD-RAM capable so you can rewrite on the same disk 100,000 times!

    Where as the DVD RW+- can only do 1000 rewrites... and isnt as reliable... but the DVD+RW is the better of the 2, behind DVDRAM

    DVD-RAM is used in IBM UNIX AIX environments for Backups...

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by marcstolk link=1180451586/0#7 date=1180482447
    While I agree a HHD would be "faster"... reliability of HHD this size (physically) would be my concern... After your 12months warrantee passes, I wonder what a HHD replacement cost is... it would be an eye opener.
    Yep, that would be a worry.... but cameras today have a life of about a year ;)

    New features (higher megapixel CCDs, ability to work at lower light levels and faster "shutter" speeds for smoother action shots), greater zoom range, better recording media, on camera editing etc make a 1 year old camera (or pretty well any piece of electronic equipment) obsolete after about a year.... and try to get service on something a year + old..... if you are willing to pay Mega dollars... and you will need to be fortunate - spares are still available.

    My sister in law has an 18 Month old, several thousand dollar "wide screen" TV. She took out the extended 4 year warranty..... it failed only to be told - "Read the small print - subject to parts availability"...... and as the part was no longer manufactured / available - chuck the TV!!! :( :(

    Mmmmm

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    just to put in my opinion - I would go for a Canon or Panasonic, both make good digital cameras. Decide the budget and then get the best deal for the money.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    JavaB,

    You are quite correct indeed... Its not fair is it? Spend $1000, and next year its too old and obsolete... Even Laptops have a good 3-4 year life now with good specs....

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    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please


    Wow thats for all the replies. I knew I was at the right forum.
    ;)


    I would go with anything that can transfer the video to your pc easily, gives enough minutes to film what you will need to film and feels good in your hand
    All great points. Transfer is important.

    I guess you need to decide what you will be filming and how important you place quality of picture over price.
    Hmmm... pictures of our kids growing up mostly... how important is that? I guess the quality is not "that" important, just having some footage of their childhood is and I hate spending too long behind the viewfinder.

    The JVC we have was great 5 years ago and is still "the bomb" for on the fly firewire conversion of VHS tapes (far better than any PC video capture card I have seen) but the batteries all need replacing, the white balance is dodgy (did someone point it at the sun maybe???) and the size of it means that we rarely take it anywhere.

    All the current video cameras are small enough for Paulas handbag so we will actually use it more often (in theory).

    But youre right Andy, so much information and Jargon.. even for an IT guy like me...
    I understand nearly all the terminology but struggle sorting which of the features I will ever need. Thanks for the links Marc, some interesting comments in the couple of reviews I just skimmed... Ill read some more soon)

    I have concluded that my next one will have a hard drive (or maybe flash if the memory is big enough).
    For sure Matt. I thought the same but the flash memory ones seem too new and the HDD ones are only just out of beta really.

    I know what you mean about the data transfer sppeds, I have a half a draw full of DV tapes that need transfer/editing and cannot see me having the spare time to blow anytime soon.

    Id go to a direct to DVD recorder... with whatever features are needed.... any reputable brand... and if high quality images are the go.... 3CCD. And 16:9 is the standard for digital TV.... which shortly will be the only sets available.... so yep, that as well.
    I guess those mini DVDs will stack well in the DV-tape draw too ;)

    16:9 makes sense although I still have a 4:3 screen and it wont get changed in the next few years unless the smoke gets let out.

    Im curious how durable the DVD drives are for these though and the startup-shutdown times for the couple that I fiddled with were slow and the streaming data rate means that while they work ok they will never keep up with the HDD or memory cameras in resoluttion stakes (which may/may not be important). Still a neat concept.


    I would go for a Canon or Panasonic, both make good digital cameras. Decide the budget and then get the best deal for the money
    I used to have Canon still gear (and liked it) and I have had a couple of verbal recommendations for the Panasonic video gear as having great built quality, menus, image quality etc

    While I agree a HHD would be "faster"... reliability of HHD this size (physically) would be my concern
    Me too. I see far too many dead HDDs to feel warm and fuzzy that the data would always be safe.

    Spend $1000, and next year its too old and obsolete...
    {Cringe}


    Thanks for all the tips and thoughts.

    Currently I think Im leaning towards a cheaper one in the range and wait for the memory cameras to become the norm.


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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    My 2 bobs worth.
    I do a lot of video and photographic work and while I use equipment well outside of what is being discussed here I have a couple of suggestions.
    For sure whatever you buy today isnt going to be anywhere near current in 12 months so Id suggest you loom at the middle of the road pricing say at aroung the$1K mark and possibly turn it over on evil bay in 12 months...

    SD cards.....as previously in the thread - forget them

    1CCD Vs 3CCD......well if there is a 3CCD in the price range you REALLY want to spend then go that direction.

    DVD drives inbuilt - streaming rates arent that great, hence there is a bit of reliability issues around them.

    HDD drives could be the go but arent so great if the unit gets a great hammering ie rough treatment..

    16:9 even if you dont have a 16:9 TV screen go for it as you never know what you might end up in a few months.......

    Personally id stick with the miniDV tape format. It is versatile, pretty small, low cost, reliable and even if you only use them once cheap as chips.

    Probably put a few dollars into better post processing software to obtain a better final quality image.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Redundancy in a HHD is non existent...but there is in DVD/\/Tape ;-)

    Although you can get HHD and DVD combined units... thats an option...

    Yep, I see dead HHD almost 2 times a week... and thats in PCs....

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Yeh, good post NakedBean

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    Super Moderator Javaphile's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Something to keep in mind is that the only truely archival quality medium is digital tapes. Recordable discs can give errors in as little as a year with almost all having errors by 5-7 years.


    Java "Backup! Backup! Backup!" phile

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Javaphile link=1180451586/15#16 date=1180497897
    Something to keep in mind is that the only truely archival quality medium is digital tapes.
    Java "Backup! Backup! Backup!" phile
    And even with them it is recommended they get re-written every 5 years at most..... as they suffer from print through and degradation of the tape itself when wound in close proximity to other layers...

    Where is the old silver / dye on acetate?...... I think they called it .... ehhhhh..... was it film? ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Nostalgia JavaB ;-)

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaB link=1180451586/15#17 date=1180498521
    And even with them it is recommended they get re-written every 5 years at most..... as they suffer from print through and degradation of the tape itself when wound in close proximity to other layers...
    Hhhmmm....interesting. The last Id heard DAT/DLT tapes (assumming quality tapes were used of course) were the only truely archival rated digital medium with a life expectancy of 50-100 years.

    Got any links you can point me at for more info? I rely on my DLT tapes as a long term repository for irreplacable files, mainly my pictures.


    Java "Guarding his data" phile

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Javaphile link=1180451586/15#19 date=1180509171

    Got any links you can point me at for more info? I rely on my DLT tapes as a long term repository for irreplacable files, mainly my pictures.
    Java "Guarding his data" phile
    Nope.... that was based on policy in the equivalent of your "Internal Revenue" department here in Aus. It was following advice given by IBM on storage of digital magnetic media..... and storage was in a vault (funny that) which was kept at recommended humidity and temperature..... for some reason the department took storage of these tapes VERY seriously ;) ;)

    IBM actually said absolute max - 10 years - so Departmental policy became every 5 years..... (bit paranoid maybe?)

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaB link=1180451586/15#20 date=1180509856
    Nope.... that was based on policy in the equivalent of your "Internal Revenue" department here in Aus. It was following advice given by IBM on storage of digital magnetic media..... and storage was in a vault (funny that) which was kept at recommended humidity and temperature..... for some reason the department took storage of these tapes VERY seriously ;) ;)

    IBM actually said absolute max - 10 years - so Departmental policy became every 5 years..... (bit paranoid maybe?)
    Im glad to see my paranoia is well justified.

    Oh, did I forget to mention that those critical files are also stored on a Raid5 as well as two other hard drives in separate machines? ;D ::) ;D


    Java "Guards his data seriously" phile

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by NakedBean link=1180451586/0#13 date=1180494573
    Probably put a few dollars into better post processing software to obtain a better final quality image.
    I went through the whole "want a video camera, what do I buy" myself only 3 days ago. In the end I settled for a Panasonic VDR-D250 because it looked like a great deal. In terms of purchasing the post processing software - what would you recommend?

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Gday Andy,

    Heres another site that I have found useful for comparing hardware, but it sounds like NakedBeans got the goods ;)....

    Mal.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by kohi link=1180451586/15#22 date=1180519870
    Quote Originally Posted by NakedBean link=1180451586/0#13 date=1180494573
    Probably put a few dollars into better post processing software to obtain a better final quality image.
    I went through the whole "want a video camera, what do I buy" myself only 3 days ago. In the end I settled for a Panasonic VDR-D250 because it looked like a great deal. In terms of purchasing the post processing software - what would you recommend?
    pc or mac and how much money do you want to spend? you can say none.

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    I guess if "none" is a good option then none!!! Is that a good option? If not, I dont mind spending a bit of money if it means I get a good product - ie reliable, easy to use, worth what it costs, etc. I dont have a budget in mind as I have no idea what it would all cost. I do like quality though.

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by jimmyb link=1180451586/15#24 date=1180526628

    pc or mac
    Sorry, forgot to answer pc or mac - pc.

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Im bleary eyed having spent the last 10 hours non-stop trying to get my new desktop PC to configure a wireless router and talk to the notebook in the next room... but here goes:

    As most have observed, tape is a linear medium, becoming obsolete, because it physically has to travel through the recording and play back heads. So dowloading images takes time.

    However, degradation for domestic use should not be an issue... The professionals call it "dropouts" but on digital tapes these are rare events compared to the old analogue variety.

    Theres little doubt flash memory is the medium of the future: absolutely no moving parts. Cards have slimmed down from the "gigantic" Compact Flash to micros the size of a small finger nail. Price has also reduced drastically, and capacity is expanding.

    Nonetheless, the limited capacity is better suited for still pictures and MP3 players rather than memory-hogging moving pictures.

    3CCD or "three-chippers" are obviously better quality, non-broadcast professional standard. Great to have, but probably unnecessary for shots of the family by the pool in the backyard to be screened at home only.

    Whatever you buy will be fully functional but still obsolete next week. But if yoou wait for next week, the same dilemma applies.

    I paid $1400 for my Cannon digital 3 megapixel camera. And a further $150 for a 126 mb compact flash card.

    A great, quality machine. I said at the time: "In six months theyll be twice the pixels for half the price." And they were. But with technology, those who dont seize the moment (and the gadget) get left behind.

    --Robusto


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    Sleep is overrated Thundergod's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Too true re pixels and price Robusto.

    I bought my first digital camera 3 years ago. 3 MP.
    Its so far behind now, my phone has a 2 MP camera. Actually it has 2 cameras, the second one is only about 1 MP.

    I also bought last week a new card for said phone (1 year old).
    It originally came with a 64 MB card.
    The new one is 1 GB.
    Including postage & insurance from Sth Korea it cost me $28-08 to increase the memory in the phone 20 times.
    Damned cheap!

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    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please


    Ohhh, I should have also mentioned...

    I was TOLD to get a new video camera before we take the kids away at the end of July. I would have been happy with a super 8 (far more interesting and great value)

    ;)

    I guess the $1000 mark makes sense. It buys one of the better DV tape units and if I sold on ebay in 12 months for half price it still only cost me $10 a week.

    At least I have some direction now.

    Thanks heaps to all for your thoughts.

    :)


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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by kohi link=1180451586/15#26 date=1180528224
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmyb link=1180451586/15#24 date=1180526628

    pc or mac
    Sorry, forgot to answer pc or mac - pc.
    try - http://www.adobe.com/ap/products/premiereel/ you can download a tryout there.

    http://www.jahshaka.org/ - is open source (free) but I found it complicated. Havent tried it for a while though

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by jimmyb link=1180451586/30#30 date=1180569975
    Quote Originally Posted by kohi link=1180451586/15#26 date=1180528224
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmyb link=1180451586/15#24 date=1180526628

    pc or mac
    Sorry, forgot to answer pc or mac - pc.
    try - http://www.adobe.com/ap/products/premiereel/ you can download a tryout there.

    http://www.jahshaka.org/ - is open source (free) but I found it complicated. Havent tried it for a while though
    I use windoze movie maker that came with XP for all my home stuff. It hasnt got all the flash bells and whistles but for my home videos it does the job more than sufficiently and is easy to use. Im normally not in the business of promoting MS stuff, but it is worth a look.

    Matt

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    THis has been a very handy thread! I too am looking at getting a digital video camera and while I was fairly sure I wanted a 3ccd camera I hadnt given the recording media too much thought.

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Ive just been looking at the panasonic SD1 that records onto the SD 4gb cards. This has some attractions for me in terms of the recording media - but what say the experts about SD (or flash media in general)?

    It is a 3 CCD camera - I think I am settled on that aspect.

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by grendel link=1180451586/30#33 date=1180577707
    This has some attractions for me in terms of the recording media - but what say the experts about SD (or flash media in general)?

    It is a 3 CCD camera - I think I am settled on that aspect.
    Yep 3CCD for quality......

    Have you ever got that lovely message "file corrupt" reading from the SD card in a still camera?..... I have a few times (lost about 60 photos Id taken before I could download just 2 weeks ago..... happened before as well (Canon camera - quality SD card). If you browse the internet you will find it is quite common - so much so that there are lots of utilities to recover corrupt pictures (stills) from SD and all other forms of flash cards..... Dont know if they work for movies - and they dont always work for stills either :( :(

    It bad enough loosing a few pictures (60 is pretty bad) ..... but a whole video clip :o

    Personally - nope not for me!!!

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Ive had my share of chewed betacam tapes over the years too - does that happen with DV tapes?

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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    Ah..... betacam.... got one of those (and a full size VHS as well!)

    I dont know of anyone having a chewed DV - but as it is a streaming media - it is quite possible.... as is a hard disk crash.... a faulty DVD disk etc etc.... but I suspect these are all far less frequent than a flash card corruption.

    I dont know of any media which is "bomb proof" but Ive certainly had more than my fair share of problems with CF cards.... and so have quite a few others based on the internet tales of woe.

    My guess is DV tapes (using a new one for important recording each time) and then transferring the videos to multiple backup media - just like Java" it aint really over the top" phile has - and would always do.... is the safest option.

    Even if a tape is shredded... its normally only a small portion which is actually damaged.... the rest could be recovered.

    On anything with a directory structure (DVD, CF, hard disk).... corrupt the directory and the lot is gone.... just seems a lot more risky although I like the DVD media (not the rewritable ones).... and then transfer them elsewhere for archiving.... that would be my choice.

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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    no experience with using cards as a storage media in a camera (how much video time do you get?)

    but I have had a PDA with an SD card inside it stuck to the dash of my 4wd for years and a few others in the ashtray and never once had one fail on me, worn out a few PDAs but the cards still go strong, all have been cheap brands too

    a 4gig is about $80 these days so I guess you need to factor that to the price of tapes and your final storage method

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    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by grendel link=1180451586/30#33 date=1180577707
    Ive just been looking at the panasonic SD1 that records onto the SD 4gb cards. This has some attractions for me in terms of the recording media - but what say the experts about SD (or flash media in general)?

    It is a 3 CCD camera - I think I am settled on that aspect.
    I too was keen on the memory card cameras but this thread had put me off with mention of crummy quality. The SD1 has the quality but according to this article has a few flaws that come with it.

    Do you want to buy a $2k camera and then become the free beta tester for it?

    [hr]
    The SD1 uses a new AVCHD format for recording high-definition video. The format, jointly released by Sony and Panasonic last year, has better compression than older formats such as MPEG-2. This means you can record more in the same amount of storage.

    After transferring the video to your computer, you can burn the footage on to a DVD (using the supplied software) but youll need a Blu-ray machine to play it on. That means adding $1000 (for a Sony PS3 - so far the cheapest Blu-ray player on the market) to watch recorded video on an HDTV. The camera has HDMI connectivity, which is great, but its highly likely the video youll want to watch has already been copied to your PC - back to the Blu-ray problem. The other downside is that this format cannot be edited until video-editing software starts supporting it.

    The limitations of the format are a shame because the SD1 is a good video camera. Colours are accurate and vibrant, clarity is superb and its relatively painless to use because of the simple recording medium. There is a brilliant microphone system capable of capturing 5.1-channel surround sound and "zooming in" on a sound. The size makes it easy to handle but its almost too small as its rounded shape is difficult to hold steady when zoomed in. I like the camera. Im just not sure what Im supposed to do with the footage. Its an early-adopter issue.

    [hr]

  40. #40
    hazchem
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    Re: Video Camera -  Suggestions please

    AVCHD is a great codec that produces very nice video. In the fullness of time, like later this year Id say, all the major Non-Linear editing (NLE) providers will have adopted it. Sony Vegas & Ulead VideoStudio already supports it and Id expect Avid, FCP & Canopus to follow suit at the International Broadcasters Convention in Amsterdam later this year.

    In the wider world, Panasonic have adopted the codec for their broadcast cameras, and its also used for HD video conferencing by some suppliers. So it is being fairly well adpoted and from the looks of it will be around for some time to come.

    If you intend to edit your content Andy, I dont think AVCHD is the problem it was 12 months ago. While not all of the major NLE software providers support it today, with Panasonic taking it to the Broadcast arena I think itll speed things up for Avid & FCP especially.

    Playing back and distributing your content in HD is a bit of hassle right now though, but I would suggest that you dont let that concern you. You can always down convert to SD and distribute to family and friends on DVD. Youll still have that HD master for later on, and Blu-ray is a good archival format.

    Quote Originally Posted by grendel link=1180451586/30#33 date=1180577707
    Ive just been looking at the panasonic SD1 that records onto the SD 4gb cards. This has some attractions for me in terms of the recording media - but what say the experts about SD (or flash media in general)?

    It is a 3 CCD camera - I think I am settled on that aspect.
    if you can afford 3-chip Grendel, Id suggest CMOS over CCD. Less power consumption for more battery life and no vertical smear in your images is a definite advantage.

    Flash memory is an interesting one, Panasonic have had their P2 product around for some time in the Broadcast world, but it isnt without its issues, especially when it comes to archiving. That said, the ABC have adopted the P2 format for their ENG (News) operations so they must see something in it. Sony also announced their first Professional flash memory based camera this year, the XDCAM EX using SXS cards in the Express card format.

    So, its still kinda early days for flash memory in the broadcast end, so id suggest its a little too early for flash based camcorders in the consumer world. ARe you going to have a laptop or something nearby to ingest your content every 90 minutes or so? How many $100 cards does the average consumer want to have? How will you archive the content later when you want to reuse the card? Conceptually flash memory camcorders are a great idea, and any editor will tell you that file based workflows are a fantastic innovation in comparison to tape, but it just seems that not all of the elements are there yet.

    At least with tape and optical disc formats, you are shooting to an affordable media that is an archive format in itself. I just dont see that with $100 flash memory cards.

    oh dear, I appear to have gone on a bit. :)

  41. #41
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    If you are an early adopter of technology (I am for sure) and you are prepared to live with the current limitations and grow with its maturity then go for it.

  42. #42
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please


    Well after the bean drop off at Venziano yesterday I went into the city (Melb) strip of camera stores in Elizabeth St.

    Came home with a Panasonic SDR-H250

    Bought it for $1000 (ticket price was on special for $1187).
    True 16:9, optical stabiliser (smoother than digital), 30GB HDD, small and easy to use and takes SD cards too.

    The whole menu system is driven with a neat thumb joystick and reading the manual later I didnt find one feature that I hadnt already discovered having a play... which is always a good sign.

    Great detailed post Hazchem, I didnt see it until today.
    I did see a couple of AVCHD models but the $2k+ price tag and larger physical size out me off. Im sure the quality is great but for the most part I cannot see us using it for more than some point-in-time shots of the kids being kids.... maybe my next camera will be one of those when they are outdated and cheaper.
    :)

    The other camera that I came close to buying was the Panasonic NV-GS230. It takes mini DV tapes and at a haggled price of $795 was great value in my book.

    PS: Having just bought a hard drive video camera I dont want to hear any stories about dead hard drives ever again.
    ;)


  43. #43
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaB link=1180451586/30#34 date=1180578962
    [
    Have you ever got that lovely message "file corrupt" reading from the SD card in a still camera?..... I have a few times (lost about 60 photos Id taken before I could download just 2 weeks ago..... happened before as well (Canon camera - quality SD card). If you browse the internet you will find it is quite common - so much so that there are lots of utilities to recover corrupt pictures (stills) from SD and all other forms of flash cards..... Dont know if they work for movies - and they dont always work for stills either :( :(

    It bad enough loosing a few pictures (60 is pretty bad) ..... but a whole video clip :o
    Very disconcerting feeling Id imagine, JavaB, but Ive taken thousands of pics on my compact flash cards and have luckily never seen that message -- or heard about it until your post.

    No problems with my 2 megapixel phone camera either, although that is a 1 gb micro sd.

    Ive only just got on to standard SD cards for another appliance -- a GPS navigator (which stores pictures, MP3s and video as well as maps), and after albeit very little use havent struck the dreaded message yet either.

    --Robusto

  44. #44
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    Re: Video Camera - *Suggestions please

    Congratulations on your new toy, Andy, anything that doesnt need the last resort to use --consulting the manual -- is already a plus. Have fun playing.

    Ready when you are, Mr de Mille.

    ---Robusto



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