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Thread: Time to over-haul my roasting method

  1. #1
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    Time to over-haul my roasting method

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi All

    I've been using a KKTO for a few years (one of KK's original beta units), and after a renovation to the house, it's no longer really suitable the way it was. I have thought of a few ideas around my wood fired oven, and hooded (wood or charcoal) BBQ. Neither of these 2 options seem likely to be easy to implement or consistent, although perhaps relatively cheap.
    I could keep using the KKTO (which would mean a rethink about where and how), but the optimum roast size was only 400gm, so doing 3 roasts each weekend became too time intensive (an hour and a half from start to finish all up). I don't have the skills to modify it to take bigger loads.
    One thing I have looked at with interest is a 2nd hand commercial roaster like a 2kg Has Garanti or Solartech, and installing it in a store room I have (about 4 by 2.5m and a 2.4m ceiling). It's downstairs, and only has 1 door, no windows, so ventilation is not great. There should be no problem putting the exhaust fans through 1 wall, and an additional extra extraction fan if required, but the ceiling is out - there's a room directly above it - and the other walls back onto another room and the ground (we're built into a slope)
    I guess my question would be - is there any extra fumes (if it's gas powered) or smoke that don't get handled by the inbuilt exhaust systems of these style of roasters? If there are leaks, could they be handled by installing another exhaust fan nearby? I'd hate to be gassing myself or others through a lack of forethought and planning....
    My other concern is how much ongoing maintenance one of these units might needs, since the ones I have seen so far are 10 to 15 years old, and I'd hate to suddenly have to shell out the purchase price again on repairs :/
    Cheers for you thoughts

  2. #2
    Senior Member solace's Avatar
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    It would be best to seek professional advice, however as far as I know the cyclone systems manage everything during the roast. Post roast is a different story, the cooler tray will not capture all the smoke from the beans when they are dumped so your additional exhaust fan option would probably work well there - it is still very likely you will inhale a good portion of that initial smoke given the size of your room.

    The other thing to consider is the very real possibility of a fire (such as chaff fire) and the significant heat a commercial roaster will add to that room. Make sure you have a solid fire supression system and process in place, not really sure how you will tackle the room temp aspect.

    Are you looking to run the roaster from an LPG bottle? If so, then that’s another consideration with regards to possible gas leaks etc.

    All in all I think your proposed setup can be done. Just needs to be well planned.
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  3. #3
    Mal Dimal's Avatar
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    Definitely seek local professional advice before committing to this.
    Need to ensure that all safety considerations are accounted for given the proposed location...

    Mal.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member LeroyC's Avatar
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    As the others have said you’ll need someone to look at it for you. You might be pushing it with a 2kg roaster, but a 1kg JYR or similar could be ok.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
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    I think you will need to ensure good ventilation in your new room if there is truth behind the 'popcorners lung' syndrome as per these articles

    https://www.msdsonline.com/2015/06/3...l-health-risk/
    https://munchies.vice.com/en_us/arti...risks-cdc-says
    https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/fla...rocessing.html

    As with any claim, these should not be immediately accepted as gospel but I imagine breathing any sort of smoke or fumes in a confined area could lead to health risks.

    I also have one of the beta KKTOs which can easily manage 450g roasts and can handle up to 600g. It has the standard mods of halogen turbo oven, fire blanket insulation and silicon tube seals around the rim of the inner pot and gap between inner and outer. I also preheat to about 170 deg which shortens roast times considerably. I also at one stage used a metal plate sitting just below the inner pot to reduce volume. My KKTO sits on a computer desk with casters so I can wheel it outside if necessary.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    I think you will need to ensure good ventilation in your new room if there is truth behind the 'popcorners lung' syndrome as per these articles

    https://www.msdsonline.com/2015/06/3...l-health-risk/
    https://munchies.vice.com/en_us/arti...risks-cdc-says
    https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/fla...rocessing.html

    As with any claim, these should not be immediately accepted as gospel but I imagine breathing any sort of smoke or fumes in a confined area could lead to health risks.

    I also have one of the beta KKTOs which can easily manage 450g roasts and can handle up to 600g. It has the standard mods of halogen turbo oven, fire blanket insulation and silicon tube seals around the rim of the inner pot and gap between inner and outer. I also preheat to about 170 deg which shortens roast times considerably. I also at one stage used a metal plate sitting just below the inner pot to reduce volume. My KKTO sits on a computer desk with casters so I can wheel it outside if necessary.
    I had a 1200mm wide cabinet on wheels that I used that also had a cooling tray installed on it - great function, but didn't past the "fugly" test after the reno, and was too bulky to store elsewhere. I've heard KK say they can be modified to do nearly 1kg, but I don't have those skills.

    Saw the articles - they are what piqued my concern!

    Cheers
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  7. #7
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    Cheers for your thoughts, all.

    I may even have a friendly builder that could install a window, or even another door on the cheap, that would improve the cross ventilation a fair bit.

    You I don't much post in CS, but when I do, the replies are always really thoughtful and helpful
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stickleback View Post
    . I've heard KK say they can be modified to do nearly 1kg, but I don't have those skills.

    Saw the articles - they are what piqued my concern!

    Cheers
    I have been roasting 1 kg batches for several years
    Assuming you have upgraded your roaster to the full width agitator blade

    The only other mod required is to remove and cut the centre out of the heating element diffuser plate
    You will be left with a doughnut shape diffuser to screw back to protect the element

    The rest is roasting technique

    For 1 kg
    Generaly that involves a 5 min pre roast at 125 deg C of the beans to get heat equilibrium
    Start roast time now
    Run at full heat @ 250 deg C to first crack - Generaly first crack will come at around 10 to 12 minutes depending on the bean hardness or bean blend
    Then another 4 to 6 minutes to second crack still at full heat @ 250 deg C

    You can play around with heat and time to suit your TO output

    By the way
    This year is the 10th anniversary of the KKTO roaster
    And I am proud that after several thousand roasts it’s still going strong


    KK
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koffee_Kosmo View Post
    I have been roasting 1 kg batches for several years
    Assuming you have upgraded your roaster to the full width agitator blade

    The only other mod required is to remove and cut the centre out of the heating element diffuser plate
    You will be left with a doughnut shape diffuser to screw back to protect the element

    The rest is roasting technique

    For 1 kg
    Generaly that involves a 5 min pre roast at 125 deg C of the beans to get heat equilibrium
    Start roast time now
    Run at full heat @ 250 deg C to first crack - Generaly first crack will come at around 10 to 12 minutes depending on the bean hardness or bean blend
    Then another 4 to 6 minutes to second crack still at full heat @ 250 deg C

    You can play around with heat and time to suit your TO output

    By the way
    This year is the 10th anniversary of the KKTO roaster
    And I am proud that after several thousand roasts it’s still going strong


    KK
    Hi KK
    Thanks for that - that's far simpler than raising the floor to bring the bean mass closer to the element! Yes I have the full width agitator so I'll give this all a go on the weekend. Definitely the simplest and cheapest option thus far the
    Cheers
    Nick

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koffee_Kosmo View Post
    I have been roasting 1 kg batches for several years
    Assuming you have upgraded your roaster to the full width agitator blade

    The only other mod required is to remove and cut the centre out of the heating element diffuser plate
    You will be left with a doughnut shape diffuser to screw back to protect the element

    The rest is roasting technique

    For 1 kg
    Generaly that involves a 5 min pre roast at 125 deg C of the beans to get heat equilibrium
    Start roast time now
    Run at full heat @ 250 deg C to first crack - Generaly first crack will come at around 10 to 12 minutes depending on the bean hardness or bean blend
    Then another 4 to 6 minutes to second crack still at full heat @ 250 deg C

    You can play around with heat and time to suit your TO output

    By the way
    This year is the 10th anniversary of the KKTO roaster
    And I am proud that after several thousand roasts it’s still going strong


    KK
    Hi Paul

    Did the mods and tried an 800gm roast today with a new halogen turbo oven top. Seemed to work pretty well, but I was tracking time with my heatsnob and the computer went into sleep mode and lost it! Anyways, I probably ended up going well past about 20 minutes in total, and the beans, while looking perfect, are a bit over done and bitter (to eat). I had to judge on the probe alone, couldn't hear the cracks at all, so was guessing all the way. Great first start on a larger load though! Cheers, Nick

  11. #11
    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
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    Behmor Coffee Roaster
    Quote Originally Posted by Stickleback View Post
    Hi Paul

    Did the mods and tried an 800gm roast today with a new halogen turbo oven top. Seemed to work pretty well, but I was tracking time with my heatsnob and the computer went into sleep mode and lost it! Anyways, I probably ended up going well past about 20 minutes in total, and the beans, while looking perfect, are a bit over done and bitter (to eat). I had to judge on the probe alone, couldn't hear the cracks at all, so was guessing all the way. Great first start on a larger load though! Cheers, Nick


    You need to practice a bit
    Took me several roasts to get it right

    Have you insulated the outside of the roaster so heat is retained- I just wrap a towel around and over the lower sealing ring like a sarong and clip it in place

    Now all you can do with the first large roast attempt is allow the beans to degas 5 to 9 days and see how it brews

    KK
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